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Title: Transcript of Oral History Interview with Jenna Nelson, 2021
Collection: Augsburg Central Health Commons Oral History Project
Search Result: Oral History with Jenna Nelson (2021) Thu, 3/25 6:41PM 22:09 SUMMARY KEYWORDS people, commons, health, augsburg, treat, feel, providing, dnp, practicum, minnesota, community, pandemic, experience, lived, working, poorly, interacted, program, addiction, university SPEAKERS Isaac Tadé, J...
Show more Oral History with Jenna Nelson (2021) Thu, 3/25 6:41PM 22:09 SUMMARY KEYWORDS people, commons, health, augsburg, treat, feel, providing, dnp, practicum, minnesota, community, pandemic, experience, lived, working, poorly, interacted, program, addiction, university SPEAKERS Isaac Tadé, Jenna Nelson I Isaac Tadé 00:01 Thank you for joining us today for this oral history project for the Augsburg University central health commons. My name is Isaac Tadé, and I'm a student at Augsburg University. Could you please introduce yourself for the recording and tell us what your position is? Or was at the university? J Jenna Nelson 00:20 Yeah, my name is Jenna Nelson. I am a DNP FNP student in my third year at Augsburg University, and I'm also working as an intern with the health commons. I Isaac Tadé 00:36 Okay, great. Thank you. Before we continue, I would just like to confirm that you consent to being interviewed and having that interview stored at Augsburg University, which will be made available to the public. J Jenna Nelson 00:48 Yes, I consent to that. Oral History with Jenna Nelson (2021) Page 1 of 13 Transcribed by https://otter.ai I Isaac Tadé 00:50 Okay. Thank you. Can you tell me where you grew up? And who you call family? J Jenna Nelson 00:56 Yeah, so my dad was in the Air Force. And so I grew up on Air Force bases. We lived in Okinawa, Japan. We lived in Hawaii for four years. And then we lived in Fort Walton Beach, Florida. And then we moved to Rochester, Minnesota, where I ended up doing High School. And I was adopted when I was three months old from Chile. So yeah, my family is my older brother, Tony, also adopted from Chile a few years before I was from a different family. And then my parents who are, my dad's from Brainerd, Minnesota, so really Minnesotan and my mom's more Western, Claire City, Minnesota, a small farming town. So yeah. I Isaac Tadé 01:42 Great. Thank you. How did you end up at Augsburg University. J Jenna Nelson 01:46 So, I like the Twin Cities. I went to the University of Minnesota for my undergrad. And I heard a lot of good things about Augsburg from other people that I've met living up here. And then I worked for about 10 years after I graduated with my Rn, and wanted to live back in Minneapolis. So it just kind of was close. And I liked how the program sounded. I Isaac Tadé 02:14 Great. Thank you. How did you become involved with Health Commons? J Jenna Nelson 02:18 So for one of my classes for the DNP FNP program, Katie was the instructor and part of the class was to kind of actually be involved in the community and see different ways you can work with community members. And so one of the places she told us about this, the Health Commons, and we can get practicum hours for it too. So that's kind of how we got started with it. I Isaac Tadé 02:46 Oral History with Jenna Nelson (2021) Page 2 of 13 Transcribed by https://otter.ai Okay. And what can you tell me about your experience at Health Commons so far? J Jenna Nelson 02:51 so far, it's kind of crazy this last year, because things changed with the pandemic, pretty significantly. But before the pandemic, it seemed fairly busy, you know, you could see there's a need for this. And just kind of the relationships I saw Katie have with people who come here frequently, even interacting with people that are new to the Health Commons using some of those kind of services that they provide. I just think it's really important work she's doing. It's needed in the community, and it would be awesome if there were more places like this in most communities, because there's a need really, for this. I Isaac Tadé 03:37 How long have you been at Health Commons? J Jenna Nelson 03:40 I think I did start in 2018. I volunteered a little bit after I did some practicum hours here. And then I was free. I took a year off from school. And then when I started again, that summer, I came back so I think it was summer of 2019. I came and volunteered a couple times. And then with the internship, right when I saw that email, I kind of jumped on it and said I want to do it. So I was fortunate I get picked. I Isaac Tadé 04:07 So you're here again! J Jenna Nelson 04:08 Yeah, I am here now, yeah. I Isaac Tadé 04:10 Okay. How was Health Commons presented to fit in with your curriculum? And how well do you think your experience at Health Commons relates to what you were learning? J Jenna Nelson 04:20 Oral History with Jenna Nelson (2021) Page 3 of 13 Transcribed by https://otter.ai Yeah, so the Health Commons was, again, the Augsburg DNP FNP program specifically wants to focus on holistic community health. Family Nurse Practitioners are meant to provide preventative health care to community members. And, you know, the U.S. doesn't have a universal health care system. Obviously, there's huge groups of people who are not getting primary care, preventative care, even just kind of basic health counseling. So this kind of fit into that part of this program where they really wanted to emphasize being involved in the community, working directly with the people that you're serving, and kind of addressing those underlying problems with certain groups of people not getting the care that, you know, they need. I Isaac Tadé 04:54 So it sounds like the curriculum has really aligned with the mission of Health Commons here. J Jenna Nelson 05:23 Yeah, yeah, definitely. I mean, I would say the, and vice versa, too. I guess that would make sense. But yeah, this is really, I think the direction that they want to go with this specific program, the FNP DNP program. And I would say it's, it might be one of the only kind of parts of the program that really do. Like, it's it is what it says it is. It's not... I feel like sometimes programs can kind of, you know, they try to advertise, and they say, "We do this, we're involved in this," but then you're in the program, and you're like, "You do that for an hour, like one semester." That's not what you signed up for. But I feel like this is definitely kind of what they're preaching in the program. I Isaac Tadé 06:06 So walking the walk? J Jenna Nelson 06:07 In action, yes. I Isaac Tadé 06:08 Yeah. Okay, thank you. How did your experience at Health Commons fit or challenge your expectations? Oral History with Jenna Nelson (2021) Page 4 of 13 Transcribed by https://otter.ai J Jenna Nelson 06:17 Um, I would say it challenged my expectations. It kind of fit it, too. I mean, so working with people directly, especially people who've been marginalized, treated poorly by healthcare providers, and basically anybody who, you know, works with a certain entity, like a hospital or the government or something, I feel like, people are pretty, not defensive, but just cautious around new people. And so I guess I was surprised that people coming to Health Commons and using its services were as open as they were, to me. And then every now and then I would be surprised and taken aback if somebody...if I did something or said something that offended someone really strongly. But yeah, I guess it kind of was what I thought it would be. Which is good. Because, you know, like I said, a lot of times, people say that they're doing something, and it involves all these details, and then you do, and that's not really what they said it was, and this was exactly, you know, working with people directly and meeting them where they're at. I Isaac Tadé 07:24 And you said that a lot of people met you and trusted you and accepted the care that you were providing. Which wasn't your expectation? What do you think it was that made you approachable? As a health care provider? J Jenna Nelson 07:44 Yeah, specifically in this environment, I would just say...Katie, pretty much. They trust Katie, a lot of people here really trust Katie, and they really don't trust anyone else that is "providing". I'm doing quotes, you're providing services for them. But I think because of the direct relation and where I'm coming from. That might have been why. Also, usually when I meet people, I'm fairly quiet, and I try to let them direct the conversation or the interaction. So that might help. I Isaac Tadé 08:22 Yeah, thank you. Thank you for sharing. Did you feel as though people felt welcomed into this space? Do you have any suggestions on how we could do that better? You've already touched on this a little bit. J Jenna Nelson 08:36 Yeah, I think they do (feel welcomed). And again, the pandemic makes it, it really complicates things in terms of people feeling welcomed. Just because you can only have Oral History with Jenna Nelson (2021) Page 5 of 13 Transcribed by https://otter.ai so many people in the room at one time and then because other people are waiting to come in. They can only, kind of, spend so much time there. We try not to rush anyone out. But yeah, it's I think it would have been interesting to be here a lot more before the pandemic to see. I Isaac Tadé 09:04 The contrast. J Jenna Nelson 09:05 Yeah, but I felt like when the Health Commons was in that trailer in the parking lot, like a long time ago, before the church had finished its renovations, even though it was a tiny, cramped space, it felt super welcoming. Like it felt like a good vibe. You walk in there and you know people, it seemed like people felt like they could be there and they were comfortable. I Isaac Tadé 09:27 Okay, what strengths did you learn of, or hear from the people that you met? J Jenna Nelson 09:34 Um, people I met working or just people using the services ? I Isaac Tadé 09:39 Probably both, yeah. J Jenna Nelson 09:43 Well, yeah. I guess for the people that are coming in here that are either currently experiencing homelessness or have, a lot of the strengths are just you know, they're resilient. They still see the good in people even though they've been treated poorly. And hearing some of their stories to like, you know, a lot of institutionalized, like racism or just being treated poorly in all these different avenues. And yeah, they're very resilient. So that's good to see. And then the people working here, I would just say, their strengths are that they keep an open mind. And I don't see a lot of people here at all acting as if they know more than the people seeking services. It's kind of like, more of an even playing field versus going into like a clinic and seeing a primary care doctor or nurse practitioner. Oral History with Jenna Nelson (2021) Page 6 of 13 Transcribed by https://otter.ai Nobody's... I feel like nobody's really being talked down to they're just having conversations. I Isaac Tadé 10:50 The relationships between people providing services and people receiving them are often mutually beneficial. Would you say? J Jenna Nelson 10:57 Definitely, yeah. And and I think it's very transparent that that's the case too, I don't think, yeah. That's nice. That's true. I Isaac Tadé 11:06 Thank you. How has this experience changed any biases you may have had about homelessness, or marginalized housed individually? individuals? Excuse me. J Jenna Nelson 11:20 So like working in the emergency department, I've interacted with people that are experiencing homelessness or experiencing addiction, or, you know, they have experienced homelessness. And I think this just kind of helps me have more experience working with people who might have had those lived experiences. I Isaac Tadé 11:45 Do any stories come to mind? Um, I'm about bias or... J Jenna Nelson 11:52 like, well, I guess something, I Isaac Tadé 11:54 Maybe something that changed your perspective? J Jenna Nelson 11:56 Oral History with Jenna Nelson (2021) Page 7 of 13 Transcribed by https://otter.ai I guess some stuff. Just interacting with people here and like people opening up the people seeking services, I think I became more comfortable caring for that population in the ER. Like, I didn't realize that I wasn't comfortable with it, or I didn't realize that I was like, I was maybe just not, I don't even know, opening up enough. Like when you're a nurse, and you're working with a patient who comes to the ER, for example, like you can tell if they want to interact with you a lot. They can tell if you want to narrate their care. And sometimes when people would come in and they were homeless, I just would leave them alone, because I was like, "Oh, they're tired, they're resting or like, I'm just gonna wait for, you know, when we get the results back from their labs are x ray." But after being here, I realize no, I mean, each individual is different, regardless of whether or not they're housed or homeless or suffering from addiction. And so then I feel like I was more open to letting them kind of run the show in terms of how the interaction would happen. And I remember, like, after doing some volunteering at the Health Commons, I was working in the emergency department. And this guy came in and he was missing, I think he was missing all the toes on one of his foot. And the other foot, he was missing almost all of them too. There like there were two left. And he had just gotten off a bus from...it was either Mississippi or Louisiana. Literally the community that was serving him down there gave him a bus pass and said, "You can go wherever you want." And so he said, "I came to Minnesota, because I've heard they have really good resources up here. They treat people well." And I think it was a middle of winter too. And I'm just like, oh my God. So he had come in because he was having like, some pain in his foot. He had a little bit of an ulcer who was diabetic. So the wound healing was poor. And like, I got him a bunch of warm blankets. And I was like, "Do you want anything to eat?" I got him some food, some emergency room food, which isn't great, but I got him food. And I think every time I came in there, he was just like, taken aback, like, Is this real? And so I wonder how he's how he was treated previously, you know, in emergency room settings or in other healthcare type settings. But it was really funny. Like, I think he he thought I was like, I don't know, like, super nice. I'm like, "No, this is how we treat people here, you know, typically." I Isaac Tadé 14:13 So it sounds like originally, you had just kind of interacted with the population when necessary to provide the care. J Jenna Nelson 14:25 Yeah. I Isaac Tadé 14:25 Oral History with Jenna Nelson (2021) Page 8 of 13 Transcribed by https://otter.ai And now it seems as though you've kind of gone past that maybe eliminated some of those biases that you didn't even know you had. J Jenna Nelson 14:33 Yeah. I Isaac Tadé 14:34 And you're more interactive with the population, which provides better, like relationships for you. And probably better care as well. J Jenna Nelson 14:43 Exactly. Yeah. Like I think, just working with other people in general, especially when related to their health. It's like...you kind of have to step back and look at what your role is and how you might appear to them. And I think I didn't want to be a bother. A lot of times when people were coming in, because again, I was like this is their only time where they're getting, like shelter for maybe four or five hours or something like that. So I would just want to leave them alone. But then exactly like, the more I actually was here and had conversations with people, the more I recognize that it depends on the person, but a lot of people are craving like social interaction. And this is one of the places where they would get it would be like a health care setting. I Isaac Tadé 15:30 Wow, that's beautiful. Thank you. How would you suggest we can better accompany people on their journey of health, for example, adding more hours or adding outreach services? J Jenna Nelson 15:46 Adding more hours would be good. I know that takes people and money and time and stuff. But yeah, I think adding more hours and locations, which was mentioned before, too. And yeah, like being involved with the encampments, as well as, you know, providing meals. With the COVID, providing immunizations, if we have some bringing it out to them versus expecting them to come here. But yeah, basically just being more even more visible in the community than they already are, would be good. Oral History with Jenna Nelson (2021) Page 9 of 13 Transcribed by https://otter.ai I Isaac Tadé 16:21 Outreach more? J Jenna Nelson 16:22 Yeah, yeah. I Isaac Tadé 16:23 Okay. What, if anything, will you take forward with you, from your experience? For example, has this experience impacted your future career ideas or personal goals? What was the most valuable part of your experience? Actually, I'll just ask that first question. What, if anything, will you take forward with you from this experience, J Jenna Nelson 16:49 Um, just, again, that people are extraordinarily resilient, like mentally, physically, and that, again, everybody has a story, and everybody has a reason for being the way that they are. And even if it comes off as harsh or rude, or, like, you know, they're having a really bad time. So just keeping that in mind, not taking things personally, and trying to, you know, individually, respond to somebody versus assuming, making kind of stereotypes you know, about what they might need, based on how they look. I mean, when I look at someone, now I look at them, and I'm like, I have no idea what they want, I need to I need to communicate with them. Whereas before, I might have made assumptions. Is that a practice that you learned here? Or through Augsburg orsomething else? Definitely, with the programs. I think it's 803 is the class, I can't remember 802 or 803. But yeah, like, any of the practicum hours that we did, especially with the Health Commons, I feel like kind of foster that. So. I Isaac Tadé 18:01 Okay, thank you. What was the most valuable part of this experience? J Jenna Nelson 18:08 So far, I think it's been seeing, like, the relationships that Katie has with people and then just having time to work with people here. I think it's just, you know, things take time. And to have the chance to do this is awesome, especially to get like, you know, do the internship is amazing. I would have volunteered regardless, but to have an internship to Oral History with Jenna Nelson (2021) Page 10 of 13 Transcribed by https://otter.ai for students is awesome. Yeah. I Isaac Tadé 18:37 What was most useful to you? J Jenna Nelson 18:41 I'm probably having Katie, as a, I'd say mentor, like somebody I can ask questions to. And I don't have to be afraid that maybe I just sounded like I'm stereotyping someone. Like it's a very open conversation. And if I have questions about, you know, how she interacts with people when they treat her a certain way, I know, it's an open space. I don't know what they call it in the woke community. I Isaac Tadé 19:07 Like a safe space space. Yeah. for learning and for... J Jenna Nelson 19:10 Yeah, yeah, there's not... I feel really confident too that there's not judgment. It's more like, okay, like, open your mind. We're learning together here. So, yeah. I Isaac Tadé 19:20 Wow, that's beautiful. What do you think Health Commons could do better? Is there anything missing? J Jenna Nelson 19:27 Um, I don't know. That's a good question. I would have to think about that. Okay. But I mean, yeah, it's just sometimes I like the idea of telling people they can only take so many things like the whole...I think... I Isaac Tadé 19:47 Limited resources? Jenna Nelson 19:48 Oral History with Jenna Nelson (2021) Page 11 of 13 Transcribed by https://otter.ai J Jenna Nelson 19:48 Yeah. It's the limited resources and the reason for it is because there's limited resources Funding and like, yeah. But no, I think, again, outreach and of promoting their existence so people know they're here, is good in the community. I Isaac Tadé 19:52 Funding, yeah Is there anything that you would change about the internship experience? J Jenna Nelson 20:12 Um, I don't think so. No, I, I think it's gone really well. It's nice and convenient to be able to schedule online. We have that too. So, no, that's good. I Isaac Tadé 20:24 Okay. Is there any specific story you would share that stuck with you, from your experience at Health Commons? J Jenna Nelson 20:38 Initially when I was doing 803, and volunteering and getting practicum hours, I think it was 2017 or 2018. But I did an oral history for a gentlemen that frequently came to the Health Commons. And I talked to him for about 45 minutes. And once I was typing it up, typing up the transcript, I realized, like... I don't know, some of the stuff that he'd been through was like, he had no control over it. And he had suffered from alcoholism. And he was treated really poorly in a lot of environments because of his history of addiction. And it was just another example of like, how issues with addiction and at least our community, I want to say generally our country, probably worldwide, are just, I mean, we really need to work on how we treat people with addiction issues. I Isaac Tadé 21:36 We punish rather than treat. J Jenna Nelson 21:38 Yeah, and I mean even...Yeah, definitely we do that. Oral History with Jenna Nelson (2021) Page 12 of 13 Transcribed by https://otter.ai I Isaac Tadé 21:43 Yeah. Okay. Is there anything else that you'd like to add that we haven't talked about? J Jenna Nelson 21:55 No, I don't think so. I Isaac Tadé 21:57 Okay, I think this concludes our oral history. Thank you so much. J Jenna Nelson 22:03 Yes. You're welcome. Thanks. Oral History with Jenna Nelson (2021) Page 13 of 13 Transcribed by https://otter.ai
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Title: Transcript of Oral History Interview with Isaac Tadé, 2021
Collection: Augsburg Central Health Commons Oral History Project
Search Result: Oral History with Isaac Tadé (2021) Thu, 4/8 5:57PM 33:10 SUMMARY KEYWORDS people, augsburg, commons, health, pandemic, haircut, internship, community, person, dentistry, katie, intern, homeless, life, dental, assume, site, dentist, encampment, evicted SPEAKERS Kathleen Clark, Isaac Ta...
Show more Oral History with Isaac Tadé (2021) Thu, 4/8 5:57PM 33:10 SUMMARY KEYWORDS people, augsburg, commons, health, pandemic, haircut, internship, community, person, dentistry, katie, intern, homeless, life, dental, assume, site, dentist, encampment, evicted SPEAKERS Kathleen Clark, Isaac Tadé Kathleen Clark 00:03 Thank you for joining us today for this oral history project for the Augsburg University central health Commons. My name is Katie Clark. I'm an assistant professor of nursing. Could you please introduce yourself for the recording and tell us what your position is at the university? I Isaac Tadé 00:20 Hello, my name is Isaac Tadé. And I am a student intern with Augsburg Health Commons at Central Lutheran Church in downtown Minneapolis. Kathleen Clark 00:35 Wonderful, and what year are you in the undergrad? I Isaac Tadé 00:39 I am a senior in the undergrad at Augsburg studying biology and with a minor in religion. Kathleen Clark 00:46 Oral History with Isaac Tadé (2021) Page 1 of 12 Transcribed by https://otter.ai And do you know what you'll be doing when you're done? I Isaac Tadé 00:49 I do. After I finished this year, I'll be starting dental school in the fall. Fall 2021 at the University of Minnesota School of Dentistry. Kathleen Clark 01:01 And what are the internships called that you're doing? I Isaac Tadé 01:05 I am a Christensen scholars intern through the Christensen scholars program at Augsburg Kathleen Clark 01:12 And then I think you added another internship was that one through the Strommen center. Is that correct? I Isaac Tadé 01:18 That's correct. Kathleen Clark 01:19 Excellent. Yes. I Isaac Tadé 01:20 Double intern this year. Yeah. Kathleen Clark 01:23 And that, that for me and my role is exciting because you're the first Strommen intern we've ever had. Oral History with Isaac Tadé (2021) Page 2 of 12 Transcribed by https://otter.ai I Isaac Tadé 01:31 The guinea pig. Kathleen Clark 01:33 Right, so great. Before we continue, I would just like to confirm that you consent to being interviewed and having the interview stored at Augsburg University, which will be made available to the public. I Isaac Tadé 01:45 Yes, I consent. Great. Kathleen Clark 01:48 So just to start off, can you tell me a little bit about where you grew up and who you call family? I Isaac Tadé 01:54 For sure. So I'm originally from in Ngaoundéré, Cameroon. That's where I was born. And my family moved to the United States when I was four years old. We lived with my grandmother at their lake home in Bad Lake Minnesota for a summer before moving to Walcott, North Dakota, a small town of 200 people. I went to high school oil, middle school and Kindred, North Dakota. And then I moved to Windham, Minnesota, big town life of 5004 for high school, and that's kind of where I went to high school. And then bouncing around there, I decided to come to Augsburg because I wanted to be in a larger city. And I really was interested in the diversity here. And Augsburg was a D3 school where I could be involved with a lot of things such as the track team, cross country, the choir, things like that. So that's kind of what I've done. That's why I'm here. Kathleen Clark 03:11 Did Augsburg meet those expectations for you? I Isaac Tadé 03:14 Yeah, Yes, it did. Augsburg delivered, and then something I've really enjoyed my time here. Oral History with Isaac Tadé (2021) Page 3 of 12 Transcribed by https://otter.ai Yeah, I only have positive things to say about about Augsburg again. And I love where I'm at. So that's kind of a part of why I've decided to stay in Minneapolis for the next four years for dental school. So I love it here. Kathleen Clark 03:36 How did you become involved or hear about the health commons? I Isaac Tadé 03:41 So through Christensen scholars, we are given an internship, and it was who was it the internship kind of director? Kathleen Clark 03:56 Jeremey Meyers I Isaac Tadé 03:57 There we go. Thank you. Jeremy Meyers, kind of forwarded in emails saying that there was this potential opportunity to intern at health commons working with people who face to come from different disparities and who, yeah, and just kind of do health care work. And that's really interested me and I wanted to get into the field more, and work with real people. So that's where the connection was made. And then he introduced me to you, Katie. And from there, we've just kind of brainstormed how this internship would work. And this semester, I've been coming in person to help calm and site. Through the pandemic. I've been blessed that I've been able to work with real people, and not just computer screens. Yeah, so that's how I got to help doctors. Kathleen Clark 04:58 And then you've also been involved With the pre dental club, can you tell me a little bit about that as well? I Isaac Tadé 05:06 Yeah, so I've been with the pre dental club since I first came to Augsburg, and I'm currently the president of the Student Organization. Essentially, I want to give other people the Oral History with Isaac Tadé (2021) Page 4 of 12 Transcribed by https://otter.ai opportunity to access things such as volunteer hours, information about dentistry, how to apply and things like that. That's kind of what the club does. But through health commons, we've been able to do a couple different events, we've done a clothing drive. That, basically, yeah, we brought in a bunch of clothes and, and help distribute those out, bringing them to health commons and stuff. And pre dental volunteers came along with that. But we also got dental supplies, toothbrushes, floss tooth toothpaste, from the University of Minnesota School of Dentistry, and brought them to health commons, were we made health kits, and distributed those out as well, while helping lead people to their vaccine site when those are available, so that was, I think that was a really great opportunity for pre dental students to just get some more volunteering hours and to, you know, just talk about what are some of the needs that the community has? While we're in person, you know, and having these conversations with the people who are affected by it. Kathleen Clark 06:49 Can you tell me about your experiences at the health commons? I Isaac Tadé 06:53 Absolutely, it's been very insightful, I think that would be the best word. I think I've since moving to the city, I've always seen homeless people around. So when I would go running on the Greenway, or downtown or by the river, I would always see people who are facing housing insecurity. And I always just felt bad. And I never really knew what to do, even when you go to the grocery store, you know, there's usually someone on the corner or something, asking for ways to just get by. And so I always feel bad, but I never really know how I can help or how I can be useful. And so I think this experience has been really insightful. Because before I really thought that, you know, I needed to get my degree. And through that paperwork, you know, I would have the tools necessary to make a change, but that's really not the case. I think, each day, if you just bring a positive attitude, if you are approachable, if you are hospitable. If you are friendly, and and humanizing, you can really make a difference, and to people, even if it's just listening to them and having a conversation. It's helping someone else's life. And I think that's really a beautiful thing. So I think that's kind of been my experience at health comments. Um, it's been really insightful. I think that's kind of where my mindset has switched a little bit. Kathleen Clark 08:44 So has the health commons, been able to fit into some of the course content you've had? As far as are you? Do you find time that you're like, Oh, this is what I would learn at the Oral History with Isaac Tadé (2021) Page 5 of 12 Transcribed by https://otter.ai health commons. And now I'm reading about it in class. I Isaac Tadé 09:04 Yeah, I think so. I mean, just generally speaking, our experience mission is to, to see and to serve the neighbor to live with the neighbor. And like I said, being in the city, your neighbors, often homeless people. And so just being aware of that, I think is a big step. And I think that really fits into how Augsburg does about its admission. In the Christiensen Scholars Program, we're reading a book called vintage sinners and saints. And it's basically talking about like, everyday people who have glorified God. Through struggle and through strife and through depression and through old pression So it's just this idea that every person is like a two sided coin, we often see like these glorified figures, but we don't take into the consideration of what their human life is really like, you know, recognizing that people are just human. And I think that two sided coin is very much present with every one of us, you know, we can't just see the best in people, we can't just see the saint. There's also a center behind behind that, that mask, and we can't just assume that someone is a full, fully a sinner, either. And so yeah, I think that's kind of how I see our curriculum in the program being implemented in our, in our work at Christiansen are at the health calmness, because we can't make those assumptions that a person is fully one or the other work. We're complicated. Kathleen Clark 11:04 So do you feel as though people feel welcomed in this space? And do you have any suggestions on how we could welcome people better? I Isaac Tadé 11:13 For sure, um, from what I've seen, people are really treated as fully human at health commons, people are welcomed in with a lot of hospitality. And with a lot of grace and with little to no judgment. And with little to no questions or pressure of their, excuse me, current circumstances. That's from what I've seen, people are met with like a level headedness. And there's no condescending attitude. So I think health comments does a really good job at that. And when I started, Katie, you talk to me about those things. And you talked about how we don't judge here, and we just try to meet the needs of the people where they're at. And we can't assume we know what their needs are. Those things are really important. And I think health commons does an excellent job at that. Oral History with Isaac Tadé (2021) Page 6 of 12 Transcribed by https://otter.ai Kathleen Clark 12:17 What strengths did you learn of or hear from people that you've met? I Isaac Tadé 12:23 Yeah, I think there are so many people in the homeless community who are absolutely hilarious. They're just so funny, and they're just bright, and funky. And just like, fun people. And I think that humor is an excellent way of showing resilience, and of bringing light into situations or lives that might otherwise be very difficult. And so that's one thing I've really noticed about some of the strengths that people have. I think the homeless community, they really understand their own needs to they they see from a certain perspective that that person like myself, who hasn't experienced homelessness just doesn't have a perspective that I don't have. They talk about how things can improve physically, with their mental health with maybe dependency with spirituality, a lot of social issues they often discuss in detail. And with solutions, it's it's incredible how some of these people aren't politicians, because it seems like everyone has an answer. So I think they have a certain perspective, and they understand their own needs. Very well. Yeah. Kathleen Clark 14:14 So has this experience changed any biases or thoughts that you might have had about people experiencing homelessness, or who were marginally housed? I Isaac Tadé 14:24 Yeah, for sure. Um, I think I'm learning a lot more about this country. While I'm learning about people experiencing homelessness from this country, I realized that it has oftentimes very little forgiveness. One time offenses can land you in jail, which means you have a massive stain on you and your record and it follows you throughout your entire life which is unfortunate preventing you from Getting a job housing insurance. Even seeking health care becomes difficult sometimes because of these things that are often misdemeanors. So yeah, I think oftentimes people think, well, if you're homeless, you deserve it. And why don't you just get out of your own situation, everyone has a hard life. Pull yourself up by your bootstraps, this is America, you should be able to get things done. But that's just not how it works. There are so many alternative circumstances that that affect people. And, and as individuals at the time, they may not have the resources to pull themselves out. Um, and this country really isn't forgiving of that. For example, I talked to a woman outside of target. A few days ago, I brought her some granola bars. And she had said that she was working, I think it was staples, or something like that. And then, at the Oral History with Isaac Tadé (2021) Page 7 of 12 Transcribed by https://otter.ai beginning of the pandemic, she lived with her boyfriend. But the staples closed because of the pandemic, and budget cuts, and they just couldn't afford to stay open any longer at that time. And so, because of that, she was already pretty short on cash from kind of just working this minimum wage job with her boyfriend, and then they weren't able to afford housing in the city, because it's expensive. And so they were evicted. And then from there, through the eviction process, they lost a lot of their paperwork, and contacts. And it very important thing such as like, social, social security card, and I think she even lost her wallet. And so she wasn't able to apply for funding like assistance funding, or she wasn't able to look for another job. And the pandemic was just raging on, so no one was employed anyways. And everyone she knew, was basically out of reach just because of personal reasons. And she couldn't go visit her mother asked for help, because her mother was in like a nursing home. And so there are those bills to pay as well. So huge, that she had no choice but to be homeless, and be out on the street asking for money, you know, and but I think we just assume, in this society that your life is totally in your own hands to control. And I think that's just not the case, oftentimes, so just trying to be more forgiving. And I wish this country was more forgiving, too. That's what I'm learning. Kathleen Clark 18:18 Do you have any suggestions on how we could better accompany people on their journey of health? Or have you seen anyone be accompanied on their journey of health? I Isaac Tadé 18:34 Yeah, I think just considering health is, well, it should be well rounded. Including things. I mean, physical, mental, spiritual. Health commons does a pretty good job of covering the spiritual and physical right, we have nurses, and we have spiritual leaders in the community in the church. But you know, there, and I suppose they cover the social as well. But I think there's just there's more to it. Um, we could talk about, you know, financial, Can Can we have a financial adviser, or, or a social worker or someone with job assistance? I know and I don't know the full workings of, you know, how it comes or whatever. But yeah, I think it's just important to consider the whole person. Kathleen Clark 19:42 So what, if anything, will you take forward from this experience? For example, has anything impacted your future career or personal goals? Or what has been? Yeah, just most valuable or useful to you? Oral History with Isaac Tadé (2021) Page 8 of 12 Transcribed by https://otter.ai I Isaac Tadé 19:57 Yeah, I think one of the most important lessons Just to never judge someone based on the position that they're in, and never assume that I know what's going on in their life, or that I can pin their existence down to one or two mistakes in their life or one or two events in their lives. People are so much more than that. For example, I was talking to a person that health Thomas who goes there for services. And he told me about this story when he was riding the light rail, and it was a domestic abuse situation. And he asked this woman Well, why do you? Why do you take this? Why do you keep letting this guy abuse you? And he said, she said, it was better to get abused by one man than by 12. And so that just blew his mind. It's like, well, you want the best for this lady. Okay? If he if he were to cut this guy off, that's her protection from these 11 other, you know, 12 other dudes who could be messing her life up even worse. And so that really taught me quite bluntly, to never assume you know, the best in someone's situation and never assume you have their situation figured out. I think it's always important to ask how you can be of service, what needs Do you have today that I can meet? I think that's a good way to approach conversation. I'm in service, yeah, a conversation in service. I also will just be, I really want to go into community health from this point forward. Like I said, I've always felt like I I noticed people who are marginalized, and I feel bad for them. And then it used to be that I, I just, it just stops there. I just stop and I feel bad. And then, you know, I get over it. But I think at this point, I really want to continue my impact. And I would love to work in a community health setting in the future as a dentist, and maybe even go to public health school. And I don't know, we'll see. But I'm just really interested in the community health dynamic. And I think that's where my heart and skill sets kind of best meet the needs. That I see. If Katie, if you ever see me do cosmetic dentistry, if you ever see me just like doing veneers and like tooth whitening, something had gotten very wrong, because I don't want to be a strip mall dentist, if that makes sense. And that's just not who I want to be. So he ever seen me on a strip mall? Today's teeth in the suburbs that asked me a few questions about how life is going. So that's just who I am. Kathleen Clark 23:40 So can you tell me a little bit too, like I know, for the whole year, you're able to be Christiansen scholar intern. But then this semester, you came on board, like I said earlier and through the Strommen center as our first intern as the health commons engagement specialist. So given that, you know, used to do three hours a week, and now you're doing a significant amount of more, what has this internship on top of your original internship allowed you to do? Isaac Tadé 24:13 Oral History with Isaac Tadé (2021) Page 9 of 12 Transcribed by https://otter.ai I Isaac Tadé 24:13 Yeah, absolutely. So being in person at health commons. This semester as the engagement specialist, I've been able to expand on the things I was doing last year last semester, doing things such as the oral histories, just telling the stories of the people at health comments. I've been doing a lot of volunteer recruitment, through the pre dental club, just to kind of help Come out, come out and do some of the things that I'm already doing. But just with more numbers, also aiding in COVID-19 vaccine recruitment. We've had a couple days at health commons where we've been fortunate to distribute out vaccines and Volunteers are needed. So those things have all been really impactful for me and have really helped me to kind of ground myself, I think, at the health commons being useful and being of service. And then with my, I suppose free, free time outside of the internship, I've been just reading different pieces that kind of enhance my understanding of the work. I'm actually doing. One of those reading Evicted by Matt Desmond, I read that earlier this semester. And yeah, those are those are the things I've been doing with my time. Kathleen Clark 25:43 And where are you? Have you ever been able to go to the encampments at all? I Isaac Tadé 25:47 Yes, that's another thing. We were able to visit the encampments, just to see what circumstances were like there and to help distribute out water and food and some other supplies that that were needed there. Kathleen Clark 26:02 And what was your thoughts leaving the encampment? I Isaac Tadé 26:08 My thoughts were essentially that there, their encampment community was, is just integrated right into the city. It's like It's its own little corner, in a neighborhood. And it's so present, like, it's, it's right there, it's visible, it's in someone's backyard. And yet, like these inhumane conditions, are so visible, and yet, the problems aren't solved, the problems aren't seen, if that makes sense. So that kind of is what shocked me, just how present the community was, and how detached I think our society is from it. Oral History with Isaac Tadé (2021) Page 10 of 12 Transcribed by https://otter.ai Kathleen Clark 27:00 So as far as the health commons goes, is there something missing or something we could do better? I Isaac Tadé 27:07 I think health commons does a really great job of like I said, before being welcoming, meeting people's needs, where they're at creating a sense of community and a safe space for community. in so many different ways. I think, maybe like access or connection to more healthcare workers on site would be good, like, maybe having volunteer physicians, or, or dentist or social workers or therapists on site would be would be really beneficial. And I again, I don't know if that happened, or if that's happened before, other times when I'm not around, or what exactly happens, but from what I see, maybe that could be an improvement. I guess my thoughts on that have developed after I made a dental health pamphlet that we handed out with our hygiene kits, and in this pamphlet are probably four or five different places where you can go for anyone can go for reduced or free dental care. And I was handing these out to people. And one of the members from health comments came up to me, and it was just kind of like, Well, you know, this is really great, all the informations right here for you. But to most of these people, it's just another piece of paper. And that was kind of just like a reality check for me and, and the thought that you know, these people really do know their needs. But at the same time, they don't have the direct access to where they can get those needs met. And so giving them a pamphlet isn't all that helpful, it would be more helpful to bring in a dentist directly on site. And so that's one thing I've been thinking about. And I think it would be helpful to have other people on site to like I said, social workers, therapists, maybe yoga instructors, or something. Kathleen Clark 29:22 So is there a story that you'd like to share that really stuck with you? Or is there anything you'd like to add that we didn't ask about? I Isaac Tadé 29:31 Sure, I've already mentioned a few stories. But one more that just happened a couple of weeks ago, was with a gentleman. Probably one of the best dressed people I've ever seen. It's it's incredible that he's homeless. He's always coming in with a fresh pair of slacks and in a dress shirt and everything. But anyways, I noticed that he had gotten a haircut. And I complimented him on it. I said, that's a great haircut. And he said, Well, thank you. Is there Oral History with Isaac Tadé (2021) Page 11 of 12 Transcribed by https://otter.ai a place in your Oxburgh where I can get a cheaper free haircut next time? And I said, Well, no, as a matter of fact, I got up charged last time I got a haircut at the shop near campus. And he said, Well, what do you do, and I basically explained how I won't go into all the details. But I didn't get what I wanted in my haircut, and I got charged $50. And they took like an hour and a half. And I asked this guy, if I could get my normal rate of like 30 years something. And that wasn't happening. So I didn't go back to the barber shop. And he just laughed for a long time. And when he caught his breath, he explained to me that I wasn't being wise. That if I was truly wise, I would go into the community, find someone that can come back to the barbershop with me, talk to the owners, negotiate a reasonable price, negotiate a student discount, negotiate, how they, how their business model can improve, and be a responsible capitalist. And so I got this massive lecture by this homeless man, when I was just complimenting him on his haircut, and it didn't really end there either. Because I kind of came back at him a little bit. And I said, Well, I think that would be I think that would be what was the word I used? naive to go back to the to the barbershop and barber shop and assume that they would give me what I wanted the next time. Well, then it turned into Yeah, again, like this massive conversation about responsible capitalism. And then it turns into this thing about argumentation techniques and how if I wanted to convince someone, what I was saying, I needed to phrase things in a certain way or whatever. So that was just a very memorable conversation. I think we talked for about two and a half hours in and out, but it just stem from me complimenting his haircut. So add health comments, you never really know what you're gonna get. Get yourself into. And that's part of the fun about it. I really enjoy the people. And like I said, I've just been really blessed to be able to do this in person through the pandemic, because you just can't get this kind of interaction over a screen. So yeah, I think that's about it. Kathleen Clark 32:48 Wonderful, and your contributions this year have been immense and have been significant and has changed us all for the better so. I Isaac Tadé 33:01 Oh, I'm blushing. Katie. Thank you. Kathleen Clark 33:04 Alright, well, that concludes our oral history. Thank you. Happy to be here. Thanks. Oral History with Isaac Tadé (2021) Page 12 of 12 Transcribed by https://otter.ai
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Title: Transcript of Oral History Interview with Ellen Kearney, 2021
Collection: Augsburg Central Health Commons Oral History Project
Search Result: Ellen; Oral History Tue, 4/20 11:18AM 15:33 SUMMARY KEYWORDS commons, experience, augsburg, health, welcoming, remember, homeless, people, feel, interns, coming, work, housed, class, guess, guests, biases, story, spandex, nice SPEAKERS Isaac Tadé, Ellen I Isaac Tadé 00:00 Thank you f...
Show more Ellen; Oral History Tue, 4/20 11:18AM 15:33 SUMMARY KEYWORDS commons, experience, augsburg, health, welcoming, remember, homeless, people, feel, interns, coming, work, housed, class, guess, guests, biases, story, spandex, nice SPEAKERS Isaac Tadé, Ellen I Isaac Tadé 00:00 Thank you for joining us today for this oral history project for the Augsburg University Central Health Commons. My name is Isaac Tadé, I'm a student intern with Augsburg Health Commons at Central Lutheran Church in downtown Minneapolis. Could you please introduce yourself for the recording and tell us what your position at the university is? E Ellen 00:10 Yes my name is Ellen Kearney and I'm a current DNP FNP student. I'm in my second year, just finishing up my second year of the program, and I am also currently the one of two health Commons interns. I Isaac Tadé 00:18 Okay, thank you. Can you tell me where you grew up and who you called family? E Ellen 00:46 I grew up in kind of a Mayberry situation in Morningside which is a neighborhood in Edina. I have two younger brothers Tom and jack and then my mom and my dad. We always had tons of animals as well: dogs, cats, chickens, a hedgehog called Blackberry. Yeah, and Ellen; Oral History Page 1 of 8 Transcribed by https://otter.ai then now I live in St. Paul with my husband and still have a lot of animals. We have three chickens and two cats. I Isaac Tadé 01:12 Awesome. Thank you. How did you end up at Augsburg University? E Ellen 01:17 So I always knew about Augsburg. One of my neighbors growing up was actually in the nursing department, and she kind of raved about Augsburg. But I knew that I really wanted to leave Minnesota for college. So I kind of ignored the fact that Augsburg was right there next door. And then when I moved back here, now about five years ago, I found Augsburg again on the list of nurse practitioner programs, and just kind of on a whim, went to a information session and was totally charmed by Joyce. She really sold me. So it was the only program that I applied to. And here I am two years later. I Isaac Tadé 01:54 Joyce is a wonderful lady. How did you become involved with health commons? E Ellen 02:01 I'm so encouraged to volunteer in my, I think it was, 740 or 541 class. I can't remember if it was a requirement or not. But I came the fall of 2019. And then was kind of hooked and just kept coming back and kept finding ways to work it into my practicum for classes or now coming as part of the 701. I Isaac Tadé 02:28 Okay, thank you. What can you tell me about your experience at health commons? E Ellen 02:34 I'm so I'm so grateful that I got to experience both the pre-COVID commons and the COVID commons as both a student volunteer and now was an intern. So I feel like I've been able to see the commons from a lot of different angles. Every time I go to the commons, something different happens, I get to use my ICU skills and help people navigate getting to the hospital in a hypertensive crisis, or sometimes I wash feet. But I really think the most of my time at the commons is spent, just listening to people. And Ellen; Oral History Page 2 of 8 Transcribed by https://otter.ai every time I go, I just kind of love it more. I Isaac Tadé 03:10 Most definitely. How was health commons presented to fit in with your curriculum? And how well do you think your experience at health commons relates to what you were learning in class? E Ellen 03:21 I think it blended into my education pretty seamlessly. But I've definitely tailored some of my academic experiences towards my interests in the commons definitley aligns with my interests. I don't really kind of remember how it was brought up in class, I know that we were given the option of watching the video before coming and I definitely didn't watch the video the first time. But I remember it being sort of, like I remember coming to the commons and being sort of shocked because I thought that it was definitely gonna be more of like a skilled nursing thing. So I think I was, I didn't really know, or I don't really remember what how it was presented. And that maybe it was just me, like just zoning out in class. But I think it has worked really well with my education. And also for me, I think at least that it affirms that I would really like to work with marginalized populations as a nurse practitioner. I had this kind of idea when I came to Augsburg that's what I wanted to do. But really, it was just an idea. And now I have like all this practical experience to draw upon. That's been really valuable. I Isaac Tadé 04:32 Yeah, that's really insightful. Thank you. How did you experience that health commons fit or challenge your expectations? E Ellen 04:41 So like I said, it was really different. I didn't, I did not watch the video. And I came in and expected to be doing things like more like health, sort of like counseling I guess. And more like blood pressure taking and less, definitely less relationship building. And I think it took coming back a few a few times for me to really see the mission and then coming to the commons as a regular for me to really kind of understand the work. But it was only a while before I realized, what kind of was the mission of the commons? Ellen; Oral History Page 3 of 8 Transcribed by https://otter.ai I Isaac Tadé 05:20 Did you feel as though people felt welcomed into the space? Do you have any suggestions on how we could do better. E Ellen 05:29 Well I really hope people feel welcome. I certainly have felt very welcomed into this space myself. I think that it was so busy when I first started there that I don't remember ever, like sitting down or stopping moving until we debriefed at the end. So I don't think there was ever a time to feel unwelcomed or out of place. And even if I didn't know, where things were, or it was a bit clumsy, I remember being really helped by the regular guests. And they would kind of show me and put me in the right direction. Um, I really like the way the room is set up, I think it flows really well, and it creates this super welcoming space. I sometimes worry that like more sensitive topics are harder to discuss, which might be making people feel like a little bit more unwelcomed, I guess. I was just thinking of this yesterday. A woman came in and was wanting stool softeners. And it's like, you know, it's either one or two people kind of in there right now. And Sean, John was there. You could tell she was kind of embarrassed. But Sean John said, like very clearly like, "Oh, I don't listen to what you're saying," and he knew that it was a private conversation and made it clear he wasn't listening. So I think it still is a welcoming place. But I think sometimes with it being so small and intimate now sometimes maybe that might make it feel a little unwelcoming? I don't know. But I think overall, it is a very welcoming place and that I don't really think there's any suggestions about how we can make it more welcoming, I guess. I Isaac Tadé 06:55 Yeah, that's good to hear, thank you. What strengths did you learn of or hear from people that you've met? E Ellen 07:04 Um, I think I hear strength in pretty much every story that I hear there, and the resiliency of the guests always kind of floored me. Um, I guess I can't think of like one specific example. Right now. But I guess just the like, determination that people have they keep getting up coming back trying again, kind of all those cliches, but they're really true. I've seen over and over again. I Isaac Tadé 07:32 Ellen; Oral History Page 4 of 8 Transcribed by https://otter.ai Yeah, most definitely. How has this experience changed any biases you may have had about homeless people, or marginally housed individuals, excuse me. E Ellen 07:45 This was really my first experience working with or spending extended periods of time with people experiencing homelessness. And I think many of my biases were challenged, I mean, just thinking on the top my head about people like Paul and Sean John, who are clearly so smart, and, you know, so put together and have had just like this series of bad luck that led them to where they are and to be homeless. That, you know, that's certainly challenged some of my beliefs about our previous biases about homelessness. And I think that COVID has really demonstrated to how vulnerable all of us are, that none of our jobs are truly recession proof. And it has eluminated, how easy it is for all of us to become homeless or marginally housed. Much like Paul or Shean John or any number of the people who come regularly. Um, I think also this experience has sort of opened my eyes to more injustice. And I really never thought that the homeless was easy or fair. And maybe the people experiencing homelessness were marginalized. But I think I never fully, and I still don't fully realize how marginalized. Just yesterday, I was thinking about, as I was bringing food to the encampments, just how, like, ridiculous it is that people are still not allowed to sleep or live in public spaces, like parks. And then we still don't have enough places in shelters to house everybody. So I guess those would be some of my, I guess, I don't know if those are biases or just things that have become clear about the homeless experience. I Isaac Tadé 09:27 Thank you for that. How would you suggest suggest we can better accompany people on their journey of health, for example, adding more hours or adding outreach services? E Ellen 09:39 Yeah, I go back and forth about this. I have loved being able to connect people like Sean John and chatting to hear all his stories. And I think that's so in line with the goal of the commons but I also really wish we could reach more people. And I think that's kind of the perpetual problem in health care. We really want to see and help as many people as we can, but we also want to build relationships and friendships and like we just can't do it all. But part of me thinks that doing more might dilute what we currently have. And that if we add or change anything, or if we do add or change anything, I think it would be really cool to kind of do a poll of all our guests and maybe even going out to like the near north, or if there are other encampments that we could think of and asking people there. Ellen; Oral History Page 5 of 8 Transcribed by https://otter.ai Because I really, I don't know, what would be more beneficial. I really love what we have going on now. But certainly, if there were things that people thought that we could do different, or that we could add, I would be so interested in making accommodations and helping in other ways, too. I Isaac Tadé 10:36 It sounds like a question of quantity versus quality. E Ellen 10:40 Totally. I Isaac Tadé 10:41 Okay. What, if anything, will you take forward with you from this experience? E Ellen 10:49 Oh, um, a lot of things. Um, so I think the big one is that this definitely has affirmed that, I would love to work with marginalized populations going forward. Um, I think I feel like...so I got into nursing thinking I was going to be a labor delivery nurse and ended up kind of in the complete opposite, as a pediatric ICU nurse. And I came into this program thinking that I wanted to work with marginalized people, but was really open to the idea that, like, my education might change that. And this experience totally has, just solidified and affirmed that I would like to work with marginalized populations in some capacity. So that's kind of invaluable. Yeah. I Isaac Tadé 11:37 Okay, thank you. What do you think health commons can do better? Is something missing? E Ellen 11:45 I don't think so. I think I said when I had to interview for the commons that I thought that it could maybe be a little bit more organized. Just because sometimes I think it is hard for us to find things when Katie's not there. But I think Katie definitely took that to heart and that it is, like a lot more organized now and a lot easier for me to find things. So I think it's easier for us to be more independent there as the interns. But yeah, I mean, I think it's Ellen; Oral History Page 6 of 8 Transcribed by https://otter.ai great. I guess maybe if I was going to just talk about wishes and hopes, like it's been so nice to have that space be our own. And it would be nice to have that going forward, to not have to pack it all up every week for Sunday school, but I don't know if that would be possible in a post COVID world. I Isaac Tadé 12:38 Thank you. What could have been better in regards to your volunteer experience? E Ellen 12:48 Um, I think I'm so biased that I just love it so much! I don't know what I could say, "what would be better?" Um, I do sometimes think that... like I was saying before that sometimes it is just sort of slightly frustrating not being able to find things. But that's definitely gotten a lot better and made you feel like, I know where stuff is now and things are just more organized. It's easier, but that would be the only thing. I Isaac Tadé 13:16 Okay, is there a specific story you could share that struck you from your experience at helth commons? E Ellen 13:24 Yeah, think it was either the first or second time entering this winter, like over the spring semester. This woman came in, it was one of those extremely cold days. And she was in like a midriff spandex top and spandex bottoms, a rain jacket, and then socks and sandals. And she'd been sleeping outside. Clearly like her hands and her feet were almost frostbitten. And she just started telling us all about her story, and was super open. And it came out that her car had been impounded. She'd been living in her car and she had all the money together to get the car out, but she just didn't have car insurance and that was going to be another like two or $300 which she just didn't have. And then clearly she needed a lot of clothes and to be warmed back up. And it was just this like perfect like stars aligning experience where like everything came together and everyone worked like so well together. Pastor Melissa came in and was able to hook her up with insurance right away. People from the clothing closet were able to find her like just the warmest best clothes. We'd just randomly gotten a shipment of a ton of really nice polar fleece mittens too. And this woman, she came in just so downtrodden and ended up leaving just so encouraged and like kind of on this high. It was so wonderful to be able to take care of her in such a way and help her get her car back. So that was kind of a really...stars aligning Ellen; Oral History Page 7 of 8 Transcribed by https://otter.ai experience. I Isaac Tadé 15:09 Wow, that's a really beautiful story, thank you. And then our last question is, is there anything you would like to add that we didn't already ask about? E Ellen 15:19 I don't think so. I Isaac Tadé 15:22 Okay. Well, thank you. This has been a great experience for me. E Ellen 15:27 Thanks, Isaac. I Isaac Tadé 15:28 All right you're welcome. Ellen; Oral History Page 8 of 8 Transcribed by https://otter.ai
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Title: Transcript of Oral History Interview with Marceleen Mosher
Collection: Student Projects
Search Result: Jesse Haroldson 03/24/2022 Public History OHR Transcript Oral History Report Transcript Interviewer: Jesse Haroldson Interviewee: Professor Marceleen Mosher [00:00:00] Jesse: Okay. So starting at the very beginning, where were you born? [00:00:10] Marceleen: I was born in rural Minnesota...
Show more Jesse Haroldson 03/24/2022 Public History OHR Transcript Oral History Report Transcript Interviewer: Jesse Haroldson Interviewee: Professor Marceleen Mosher [00:00:00] Jesse: Okay. So starting at the very beginning, where were you born? [00:00:10] Marceleen: I was born in rural Minnesota, near Rush city, Minnesota. [00:00:18] Jesse: Okay. Who were you born to? [00:00:20] Marceleen: Well, my mother, Anna Marie, and I, I guess my father, I forgot his middle name, Brian. Sure. [00:00:32] Jesse: Okay. And what did they do for a living? [00:00:34] Marceleen: Oh. My dad didn't really have a job still. Doesn't really have a job but he dabbles in painting, like house painting and other kinds of fix handyman fixer upper stuff manage every once in a while, like does house projects and then has managed it managed apartment buildings. Handyman type stuff. My mother is a welder and she's a certified weld inspector, which there's not very many of them. She's one of the only women. And she is one of the best welders in the state of Minnesota, she is kind of like low-key famous in the welding community. So she's a quality manager or was a quality manager at the end of her career, but now she is a welding instructor. So she teaches at the Mesabi range. The Meiji? No, no, that's not what it is. Eley Eley. And up in the iron range. [00:01:40] Jesse: Wow. She must be really good then. Do you have any siblings? [00:01:44] Marceleen: Yes. I have technically 11 siblings between both of my parents and their marriages. But I grew up with two little brothers and the eldest of all of the siblings. But yeah, two little brothers. [00:01:58] Jesse: Okay. What was it like growing up where you did? [00:02:01] Marceleen: In the country? So I grew up pretty isolated. We grew up very poor in poverty and grew up down a one mile long dirt road. And so we just like grew up playing in the woods and the dirt is awesome. We lived on a lake, so we really into nature. So I grew up surrounded by nature in nature hiking, backpacking, camping, just anything in and around nature that was like our whole lives. And then I grew up in a really small community. And I was really fortunate when I lived in Minnesota. Minnesota has a lot of really cool programs for women to be a part of the sciences and mathematics and stuff. So I got to be a part of, I was a mathlete mathletics or something. It was called it, or that was not what it was called. I don't remember what it was called, like math bowl or something. And then I got to be in advanced math classes and advanced science. And had a lot of really cool opportunities up until junior high. And then we moved to Wisconsin where they didn't have the same kind of things. But so like my little small town, we had future leaders of America. It used to be future homemakers of America, but it was renamed about the time I was in it. And I got to meet, you know, our elected representative as a part of that. So I had a pretty cool, like growing up in a little small community, there was a lot of cool opportunities and chances to see the world outside of Rush City Minnesota. So, yeah, that's cool. That's good. That's good. [00:03:36] Jesse: good. Given your expertise in communication were you a good public speaker as a kid? [00:03:42] Marceleen: Yeah, I was in debate and in, well, we call it forensics here at Augsburg forensics league, but I think we just called it speech when I was younger. So I competed in the forensics teams and I did, you know, dramatic interpretation. And what else did I do? I did do a comedy. You did, like, I did a comedy routine with somebody else, and I did debate, which, you know, debating issues did that seventh and eighth grade. And then Wisconsin didn't have those things. So when we moved over to Wisconsin, they didn't have that. But yeah, so I've been interested in public speaking for a long time. And I even when I had, it's a long story, but I was coerced into being in a beauty pageant because my, like a close friend of the family was running it and they didn't have enough people participating. And so I was kind of always standing up against like norms and expectations. And so I was like, I do not want to be in it. And they convinced me to be in it. But I wore boxer shorts and a t-shirt instead of a dress and like set up, like I just did everything opposite. I got miss congeniality, but I'm pretty sure that's because there was only four of us and there was for a second, third, and then miss congeniality. So and then I did my talent was a speech I did a month. Comedy monologue. So yeah. I love public speaking. [00:05:15] Jesse: Sounds like it in a different dimension of communication, do you think that you were even at a young age gifted at conveying your emotions, being able to you know, on a deeper level of communication, do you feel like you were inclined in that area? [00:05:29] Marceleen: That's a good question. I don't think so. No, I, I grew up, you know, I, I was really poor as you know, which when we were kids, we didn't know it was a thing. It didn't, we didn't know it mattered. We just didn't leave our property. Right? We did adventure camp. We did things like that. But when I got into school, I realized I was poor because people made fun of me for the way I dressed. Right. So I was really, really quiet. I didn't really talk to anybody. The only people I talked to were like my teachers who were really supportive and it wasn't until the fifth grade, when I was sick of being teased that I really developed, like kind of this like class clown kind of persona I'd make fun of myself before others could make fun of me kind of a thing. And that's when my communication skills kind of came to life. I realized the power that you had in, you know, over what people in your family. You know, wherever the, you could shape the situation you were in by how you communicated in that situation. So so I guess maybe fifth grade is pretty young, so yeah, maybe, but I started, I was very shy and very quiet until I got sick of being teased. And then, yeah. [00:06:48] Jesse: Well, some of the things you've said in there kind of lead me into my next question. You said that you were learning things about communication and then kind of adapted from there. Is that to say, as soon as you started to learn about how to better communicate, become that class clown, did you develop a a real interest, you know, from that young age, in the science of communication? [00:07:07] Marceleen: No. So I think just, it was really just natural. I wasn't thinking through these things. Right? It was just like I realized, oh, if you make someone laugh, they stop making fun of you. Right? Like it wasn't, I wasn't conscientiously looking at it as communication. It was just like in the right. But when I got older, I started recognizing a pattern that I could solve problems because I was really good at listening and really good at articulating. I could say, oh, I hear that this is what this person is saying. And what's, I was a good facilitator. And so when I got into I worked in the art, like I wanted to be an architect when I grew up. So I went to college for architecture. Long story short and realized I hated drafting. And so I, I was like, oh my gosh, I hate this. But I got my first real drafting job and it led me to another drafting job. And I realized that what I was good at was helping engineers communicate with architects because they don't use the same language and the way that especially, and then eventually contractors were included. And so I figured out it took me a couple of years, you know, I just thought, oh, I really like this job and I'm good at it. But when I had gone back to college, so in like 2006, I had gone back to college for teaching and wanted to be a teacher. So while I was working at the architecture firm doing this kind of this translation between teams and I was in, in school. And then I just really liked all the communication classes and it just clicked that, oh, that's what, that's why I'm good at my job, because I'm really good at communicating and the architects are terrible at it. And so are the engineers and sort of the contractors and I can help translate basically between these different teams. And so I, that's when I decided I want to do this for the rest of my life. And then like through, when I shifted over into communication courses and, you know, abandoned teaching, which obviously came back later. Yeah, so anyhow, so then when I started to, you know, but into the concepts and the theory that helped me to understand why communicating effectively has the results that impacted does in life then I was like, oh, this is the best thing ever. This is what I want to do with my life. And so, yeah, so I switched to a communication major probably about a year into my college adventures. [00:09:39] Jesse: That paints a big picture for a lot of later questions I have. So it's good that we're getting a, a whole general concept of your, you know, your trajectory. I am curious to know, I felt like I had to add, if you in general, like to learning in school. [00:09:52] Marceleen: Yes. It's my most favorite thing. It's to me, magic and learning is the most important thing in life. Everything else comes second to it, you know? It's like a superpower. And so, yeah. I love learning. I'm a naturally curious intrinsically motivated learners. So [00:10:14] Jesse: Yeah, I feel like I'm discovering that superpower, you know, during my time here at college too, it's something I didn't appreciate before in high school. So. I'm really glad that I pick that up, but I'm glad that you were gifted with that as a, as a youngster. So given that answer, did you maybe not in say middle school, but maybe high school, were you thinking about higher education then? [00:10:34] Marceleen: No. So I grew up rural America where in, you know, I was eighties and nineties and so I was conditioned and expect it except for, by my mom to like get married and have kids. So going to college, wasn't something I ever really thought about or thought that I would do until I got older. And my mom's like, you need a trade, you need a trade, you need to trade nd so that's why I decided to go into drafting because that was a trade and my mom is a trades person. And so that was her pushing for you know, need to go into the trades. And so, yeah, no, I was a terrible student in high school. I was a very good student until we moved to Wisconsin and they didn't have the same kind of programs. They didn't have the same kind of classroom experience where we lived. We lived just across the border and Grantsburg Wisconsin. And so it just was, I barely, I barely made, I failed algebra. I barely came to school. I was a real rebel, barely made it through. So I was not a good student for a few years there, but that's okay. [00:11:39] Jesse: That kind of I think you were hinting at it there, my next question is the quality of your school through elementary, middle and high school. Was it shoddy given the, the environment that you were in, the small community you were growing up in? [00:11:52] Marceleen: Okay, you know Rush City had a lot of really progressive as in supportive programs. And so they, Rush City was a wonderful experience. They recognized, you know, my, what my skills were and they gave me avenues to deepen them and pursue things that I was interested in. And without had I gone to school just to in Grantsburg where they didn't have the same options I don't think I would have developed into the kind of learner that I am today. And so rush city was an amazing. I had some really amazing teachers, amazing programs. And my mom worked in the trades. She worked from 6:00 AM till 6:00 PM board or five days a week. Sometimes she had to work on the weekends. So my mom was not home a lot and she valued an education. But again, she's a single mom for most of most of my youth. And so my mom wasn't really there to support my education. And so having a parent, I didn't really have adult support outside of school. So I'm really grateful for the education I got in our city, the, the Wisconsin schools or the Grantsburg Wisconsin school, the high school was terrible. Was. Not, I mean, there was some really amazing teachers. I had a teacher there that like transformed. I have like five teachers that have transformed my life, but she really like, she was mean, and everybody hated her, but she, she was magical. Like she, she forced me to see that I could, you know, I could do it. I could do it even if it was hard. I loved her. Anyhow, so yeah, not a great school system though. [00:13:35] Jesse: Oh, okay. Well, I, you know, I don't even have this written down, but I feel like the more I've talked to you, it seems like your mother has had an influence on you given you know, you say she's independent and she's a very successful welder, wanted you to get into trades. I feel like she's a very strong role model, essentially. Would you say that's accurate? And if so, if that's how you perceive it, could you elaborate on that? [00:14:01] Marceleen: My mom is one of the coolest humans on the planet. She taught me. You know, she pushed back on the dominant idea that women had to be married and had to have kids. And she really pushed me to consider a life without having children and without having a family and living on my own and doing whatever I wanted. She, and she was great at inspiring curiosity and asking why and explaining why, you know, like when things would happen, I would be like, oh, why did this happen to my mom would just tell me, oh, probably because of X, Y, Z, like, she just helped me understand that everything is so interconnected and, you know, we are all connected. Like she just has a really beautiful way of seeing the world. It really shaped me. My mom's awesome. I don't know what else to say other than just very grateful for my mom, unconditional love and support, even if she wasn't around as much as maybe other parents, but yeah, she was bad ass still is a bad ass. [00:15:04] Jesse: Okay. It sounds like, it sounds like it. Your transition from high school into Augsburg, what happened in between. Was there anything in-between? [00:15:14] Marceleen: Yes, like 150 years of hilarious, traumatic, wonderful stories. So I graduated high school in 1998. I went straight to a tech school, hated it, quit. worked until 2006. When I started going back into college, I went to Normandale for my associates degree. And I actually went to Augsburg for my undergrad. And so I ended up, I had a teacher at Normandale who was like, you’re so like, you have to pursue this. You can't just get your associate's degree. I hadn't considered getting a bachelor's degree at that time. So it was like 2008 ish. And so she told me about the program at Normandale. They partnered with Augsburg. So you could do classes. Augsburg used to have a weekend adult college. And so you could just do classes across, basically they did it, I can't remember if they used quarters or was trimesters, but it was totally different than the undergrad experience. Like you just, you could sail through completing your degree really easily. So any who, so that's how I got connected to Augsburg through that opportunity, because I was like, I'm not. Because I was a full-time I, you know, had a career already. I was doing construction administration and you know, doing all that technical communication and risk analysis and writing, and I had a real job. Right? And I worked 50 plus hours a week. So I I was like, I will take me five years to finish. No, I don't want to do that. So anyhow, I ended up coming to Augsburg. I did the appointment, we built out my entire, because this is how I roll, built out my entire like plan. And then I just plowed through it, like at my bachelor's degree and I was in class. So this is how this, maybe more than you want to know, but I was in class actually in that room. Right around the corner. I was in a class with Dr. Chamberlain, Kristen Chamberlain, and she was explaining communication theory. It was the introduction to com studies and she was explaining this theory. And I always forget that there is name. I always say it's Barbara, somebody it's, Kristen's like, no, it's this other person. But anyway, I forgot, but it was talking about gendered communication and the way that she was talking about it was, it did that magic learning thing for me, like sparked in my chest. And I was just like, oh my God, this is just like, explains everything in my life. And it was just this magical moment. And then all of a sudden I was like, oh, this is what I want to do. I want to make magical money people like I just had, I want to, I want to teach communication because to me communication, the study of communication the application of these strategies and tactics, how to communicate effectively the examination of hidden values and meaning in messages like this is my life, right? Like this is how I make sense of the world. Everything to me comes down to communication. And so I was like, that's what I want to do. So it was in that classroom in the year 2011, actually, that I decided that that's what I wanted to be because I loved teaching. And that was a part of my job. I always really liked cause I did a lot of training. And so I had originally gone back to school for teaching elementary education. Middle school sciences, what I was going to teach, but anyway, so blah, blah, blah, long story longer. I just was like, okay, cool. So then I asked Kristin, how does one become a professor? So she kind of talked me through it and I was like, cool. So I've been on I, and I've had a career the entire time. And I was married for like I was with my partner at the time. So I was married up until 2019. So I had a family and a career and a two hour commute and, you know, I still figured out how to make it all happen. And I started teaching in 2019. I taught during my graduate program when I got my master's, but so, yeah. And then when I got through half of my master's, because in order to teach, they have to have a minimum of basically half of your master's has to be in that study in that area. So I, once I finished. I remember if it was 16 credits or whatever, it was, you know, eight classes that I was eligible to teach. Kristen was the department chair and invited me to teach a class and it went really well and she invited me back again. And then that other places. Got jobs at other places. And I was when I finished my masters, my where I finished my master's invited me to teach. So I teach there still. And yeah, so now I start my PhD program in the fall and I quit my. Real job last fall at NPR. And yeah, I've just been teaching ever since. And it's what I meant to do is my favorite thing in the whole wide world. I love it. [00:20:10] Jesse: It being what you were meant to do I couldn’t agree more with. That is a solid timeline up until we get to the the climax of the interview or at least what it's supposed to be, which is the your Augsburg experience essentially. So I have a a number of questions here regarding that. Now that we've reached the point in your life or in the, again, in the timeline where you are here. In terms of when, when you were in undergrad and taking those courses in classes could you speak on behalf of what you thought about, and you can be as honest as possible. This isn't like a puff piece for Augsburg at all. It's a, it's an honest oral history report. The professors, were they all phenomenal? Was it mixed? Well, what's your take on the professional? [00:21:00] Marceleen: So I loved my experience at Augsburg. Being in the weekend college, there were fewer professors that taught in the evenings and weekends. And so I had less access. Like I didn't get to have a class with Bob Grohman one of the communications studies department co-chairs, you know, like I didn't, I never had a class. With, you know, folks that just taught undergraduates during the day. But like most of my classes were with Dr. Chamberlain or Dr. Lou Hako and I loved them both. And my experience here was amazing. First of all, to be able to come to college with such small class sizes, because I went to Normandale where many of my classes were held in an auditorium and there was 50, 60. In every class. And I had taken a lot of online classes before and after coming to Augsburg. And so it was just really nice to have really like deep discussions in the classroom and to be able to share ideas and articulate you know, to be able to apply. As you're learning them to your own personal experiences and express and articulate them in the classroom. It's just for me, really an effective way to learn. And so I had an exceptional experience here at Augsburg. I love the small class sizes. I loved, you know, the time worked really well for me, evenings, weekends, I could manage my job and you know, I didn't have a life, but. That was okay. So yeah, it was, it was really a really positive experience. I loved also the a lot of the other spaces in my life were really, you know, kind of white and filled with people, just like, you know, not just like me, but other, you know, other women, my age, you know, whatever. So to come to Augsburg, there were people of different ability levels, different sexual orientations, different, you know, from different countries and from different walks of life. And, you know, from the inner city, from rural America, they were just, there was, I don't know if they still have such a strong military program, but they used to have a strong military program where veterans got a lot of support here. And so I had a lot of vets in my classes and I was just like, The classroom discussions that you were able to have with people from all over. So many different experiences was really magical for me to, you know, to be in a white collar service profession, being surrounded mostly by middle-class upper middle-class white folks. You want to come here where there was people from all over the world. And with just so many different perspectives was really good for me too. So yeah, I loved my, my undergrad here. [00:23:49] Jesse: Awesome, that taps into actually a lot of the questions I had regarding Augsburg. Shortly after professors, you started to talk about the deep discussions. You felt like that was a something you weren't really to obtain at other schools. And maybe you could elaborate on how effective the learning was. Maybe the discussions played a role in the effect of learning, but in general, do you think that you had very effective learning here at Augsburg? [00:24:15] Marceleen: Yeah, really like and again, I didn't have a ton of different professors, but I think that. Small classroom size really allows from a pedagogy perspective. My, I am a student centered educator and I believe that the best way that we can teach is by teaching concepts and then having. Yeah, putting it into action, right? Like we're going to talk about something and then we're just going to do it. And I'm going to, I want you to tell me about what you think about it through your own lens of existence and through life. And so but I, I think that I built that that that student centered approach to teaching and that. Applicable applying concepts to our lives approach through my experience here and lectures were super effective. I used to hate group work and I kind of hated in class discussion at because it was just like so painful and like one person would just talk the whole time. Like, there's something really magical about having an environment where everybody feels like they can speak up. And that the instructors here did that. They could foster that environment. They made the information that they were teaching really accessible. And everybody was able to pitch it. And add to the discussion, which is again, where I see the value, right? Like talking about and explaining this concept, you can be like, okay, okay, I get that, but it's not until you start to like talk through it. Like oh, that's your interpretation of it. Oh, that's how you apply it to that experience. And like, that's what helps to build the concept up. And of course, yeah, and it's different for all, for different classes, like in public speaking. I want folks to just build their speeches and stand up and do it because that's how, that's how you learn. Like I can stand up here and talk about strategy. And how you should, you know, apply X, Y, and Z, but until you see your fellow students do it and not only what they're doing well, but what they're not doing as well. It's, it's hard to make sense of those things and make sense of these concepts, especially when things kind of seem common sense like, oh yeah, well, duh of course. Right? But until you see someone not do it well, or do it really, really well and have that emotional response or have, you know, whatever response the speaker is looking for you to have, you may not, you might be like, oh yeah, there it is. And so that was the kind of education that I got here and yeah. And that kind of taught me how not only I love to learn and love to learn, but it also helped me to build how I want to teach too. I hope that answered that question. I went off the rails. [00:27:09] Jesse: It answered it quite thoroughly I would say. Continuing, you know banking off the subject of those real personal in-depth conversations that you're able to have in a small classroom, I don't don’t think it’s foolish to make the connection that might be because it's a, it's a private school. It's a much smaller private school, not public, where it has a whole lot of state funding and create can have those giant auditoriums where, you know, you can't get that a super personal level of learning. That's obviously a big pro of Augsburg being a private school. But can you say anything about other positives and maybe mention a few of the negatives that come along with tending to a private school. [00:27:48] Marceleen: There's no money. So I teach, I went to a public university for my graduate degree and I teach there still. And there's so much money. I mean, it's just, you know, you get access to Adobe creative suite, which I'm a graphic designer as well. I like to have access to that. And I just get it because I have a Sam Houston email address, you know and the class sizes, they are, they are bigger. But there are more resources to support. You know, to support folks, but there's also less flexibility. So like I get to choose my books. I get to design my class, how I want, I have support, our department chairs are super supportive. They give guidance, they give feedback. I run like 90% well, maybe not that much. I run much of what I do in my class, pass my department chair. And I'm able to talk through things with her. I don't have that same experience at the state school. Not only because there are 20 other faculty members in my department there. So, and there's one department chair but also there's just less choice. So they already, they've chosen a committee of faculty members. Which I could have been a part of, but I didn't have time, but a committee of faculty members evaluated all of the textbooks recommended, like I said, oh, here's my textbook. I'd like to use. So they evaluated all the textbooks for public speaking, for example, and they chose the book and they're like, here you go. But our, our school isn't, or that school isn't streamlined enough where they just, you know, maybe have pre recorded lectures and the classes already built. And then you just grade, which is the case for some part-time faculty member, like adjunct faculty members. So you still have to you're constrained, but also you have some freedom at that level, but at Augsburg I'm not constrained in that way. Like the book I chose, don't tell anybody recording, but the book I chose for the semester, I will never use again because I don't think anybody was reading it. It it's just yeah, I thought it was great to have more. But I just can't go back to the pocket guide, but at a university like Augsburg, you could try something like that. You can give a book, a try and be like, oh, let's see how it works. And then be like, Ooh, I don't think this works. And then you can make a choice in another semester and you can yeah, there's a lot of support for faculty as they prepare. And yeah, and I really, really like the small class sizes and the amount of flexibility that you have, which again, those are like some of the bonuses, right? Because, well, like teachers saying you can't teach somebody else's class, you have to make it your own because just like in public speaking, if you're not passionate about it or it doesn't make sense to you, the way that something's put together, you're not going to do as good of a job. And so here at Augsburg, All of your instructors are teaching in a way that works for them. And they are bringing their own passion and expertise to the instruction in a way that, you know, like when I start, I think you, in the fall, I am teaching public speaking there and they it's a class it's prebuilt. They teach you how to teach public speaking for the you. And so I will have to teach in the way that you wants me to teach, I won't be able to, you know, teach in the way that I, I mean, I will still get to be me, but I won't be able to design the course myself and lay things out. I don't get to choose the book. It's all just like, all right, welcome to the U, and you have a person there with you your whole first semester. Who's like shaping and molding your, your instruction and your approach to ensure that you're doing what they expect you to. And for me, I am I'm always standing up to the man to me, part of public speaking and part of why it's important to have public speaking skills is you need to be able to push back on. Systems and all the structures in society and one of the strongest ways you can do that is by having oral communication skills, any who. And so like this, this class, I don't think I've done it as much, but I usually push back, like everything we learn I'll be like where, what values informed this perspective? Like why is it important that I have you stand up in front of the class? Okay. Sitting in a circle with everybody around you, you know? So so my point is, is that the private schools, you're part of why I think it's a little more magical is that there is just so much more freedom. So then folks instructors are able to show up their authentic selves and connect with students in you know, meaningful way that helps also. Private institutions, especially ones where research is really important. Your instructor may not even really care. Like teaching may not be their jam research is probably their jam. And so they're just teaching as a part of their duty to the college. They, there's not like, yeah. So at Augsburg, everybody here loves teaching because this isn't a research institution. It's a liberal arts school. So like when I go to the U research is the priority there. So I only teach one class a semester because most of my time is expected to be expended doing research for the university so. [00:33:25] Jesse: That is really interesting. The idea that, the lack of funding to maybe even the lack of a, not as ample of a salary, it almost acts as a filter to that that shows the true teachers that people actually love teaching, you know, in a non coming to a non research Institute to it's, it's almost like that's how, you know, you know, coming to a small private school like this, that's how, you know, the teachers here and they, the classroom discussions are going to be the most advantageous that's, that's extremely interesting, you know, and it's funny too, cause you went out and talking about your experience as a faculty coming to Augsburg, the private school, and I thought you would, when I first asked that question, I thought you would give a testimony on your opinion of of the tuition, the tuition factor. The fact that I am fortunate enough because I am a veteran that uncle Sam pays for half the check and then Augsburg is willing to cover the rest. So I, I, I sit here and I feel like I entered some kind of cheat code for life, essentially. But it is, you know, it's a private school in compared to a public. The tuition is quite quite meatier. And I wanted wondering what your take on that might be well. [00:34:32] Marceleen: So what are the reasons I love Augsburg is that most, I don't know what the percentage is, but most students here have some kind of financial aid or financial support. I pay. Like we can call it, there were no discounts and I didn't get financial aid, so I didn't have a pretty expensive, well, it's very expensive. But it was worth it to me because I had, I guess I hadn't even considered going to a different. Well, partly because I hadn't considered a university going to the university level anyway. But most of my friends, since they people, my age had already graduated and their school experiences never sounded like. I am like, I don't want that, you know? And so to me, it was just not even a question like this is where I want to go and yeah, it costs more money, but that's probably part of the student loan situation is that it's like fake money anyway, but. So yeah, tuition has not really, it's not something that I have even thought about. I probably spent more time thinking about private institutions relationship with religious institutions. Private schools hire in some way, shape or form affiliated with religious institutions. Augsburg of course, is affiliated with the Lutheran church. But they have a pluralistic value set where, you know, all religion has value and even the choice to see no value in religion is respected here. So I do really appreciate and love how it I'm an atheist. And so it's, it's I never have felt uncomfortable here once. Right. But I teach at St. Catherine's and like, God comes up in most emails from the president. And like, it's very, it's a, they're a really progressive schools. Really like critical feminist, like roots. But God is woven through everything. So that's, that's probably the more problematic for me area in a private institution is the likelihood of religious values shaping the experience. Like I got an offer to work and I can't remember the name of the school at St. Joseph, but they invited me, went through the interview process and I was like, cool, cool. I plan to start teaching. I think it was the semester I was going to be teaching there. And then the HR part and paperwork, you had to sign an oath. It was a Catholic institution and you had to basically sign a note that said you respected, like basically you were anti anti-abortion and like believed. So it was pretty aggressive and I was like, I cannot sign this. [00:37:19] Jesse: That’s hard to believe for it being a, [00:37:21] Marceleen: College. So yeah. I mean, that's, it was, I saved it because I was like, I want to, I want to share this. It was, it was pretty aggressive and basically like said that men were above women. It was like old school and I was like, oh, I can't sign that. And they were like, oh, you can't work here then. And I was like, fair enough, because I probably don't belong here. [00:37:47] Jesse: That, that was also going to be regarding the Augsburg experience. That was going to be one of my questions was the religious influence. Like how do you feel that the fact that this is a Lutheran private school, how that affects everything? I, I, all I can do is agree with you. You know, this is only my first year here, but it's like, there's almost, at least so far in my classes, barely any undertone of religious, of religion. In fact, they, they make it mandatory that you take a religion and vocation class. And I thought like, okay, here we go. They're going to try to spoon, feed me some Christianity, but we talk about Hinduism, Buddhism, Judaism. We talked about all the religions and I had open discussions with people of other faiths I learned so much about the religion of Islam. I thought so much about everything and it was and at no point it might've just been the instructor. I don't know how it was supposed to be taught, but yes. Yeah. And it was, it was so comforting, you know, like it, it gave me. I dunno, it's just really uplifting the fact that we could have such open discussions despite the fact that it was a it's a Lutheran school and the people who made, you know, who first established this were probably, you know, crazy Bible thumpers in all honesty to do see that this is where the colleges in present day. That was very comforting to see. [00:39:00] Marceleen: I loved my world religions class. Cause we used to have to take world religion one and world religion too. I don't know if you do have to take those two, but they were two. I did not care for one of the instructors like personality wise, but he did an amazing job and it was, I loved those classes and I would never have considered taking them. Had they not forced us to take them. Then I was like, oh my gosh, this was more like a history class. Like this is so yeah. Agreed. Okay. [00:39:29] Jesse: So we've talked about a lot of the good things it kind of is kind of almost a puff piece . [00:39:33] Marceleen: You can't help it I'm real big fan [00:39:36] Jesse: It's funny cause I'm just about out of questions regarding Augsburg. Except I, I'm kind of gonna end it on a bad note because I want your take on the location. The fact that it is a directly next to that highway there, and we've got that beautiful, wonderful wall. And also what I've heard about quite a few complaints about from the faculties, the Lutheran architecture that we have. What, what, what is your take on both of those aspects? [00:40:02] Marceleen: So I have a background in architecture. You may recall, and I am quite particular. I think the location is actually wonderful if we had more money, like if, if we had, you know a beautifully rich in payment. I would love to see the campus be walkable. I mean, not have any parking on campus because I think that would change the energy of the, of campus, right? Like if all the streets were only there for handicap accessibility and like pedestrian traffic, if that was fully where I think that it would make be next to the 94 and the big wall a lot different because our space would be, we would be able to curate more community on our space right now it's just, and so that's my biggest beef is that our campus doesn't have the same sense of like place in space that you know, I teach at Hamlin. There's no driving anywhere on campus. I mean, the, you can drive the little like golf cart and things through for accessibility and stuff, but it's enclosed and it has a sense of place in space that we don't have here on campus. But I love that we are situated in such a diverse. Multicultural community. And I think it's really important, especially since Augsburg is found even up until today, like service of vocation is core to why we're even being educated, right? Like we're being educated to be like civic citizens of the world to, to make the world a better place. That's why we get this education. Right. And so I think being situated in a community where we can put our selves to service immediately, right? Like we can volunteer in any way. Spaces, we can go have lunch and have a, you know, a native American meal. We can have a Somali meal. We can have, like, we can go share space with people from all over the world, just in a, in a walk, right? Like just walking across the footbridge or, you know, across the street. I think that our locations. Kind of core to our place in the world. I love our location. I do wish we had more money. I don't care about like the buildings kind of having that, you know, maybe it's not the most beautiful campus in the world. [00:42:29] Jesse: If you see St. Thomas to write down downtown? It's beautiful. [00:42:35] Marceleen: Yeah. I don't care for St. Thomas, but yeah, it is beautiful. It's kind of like a castle. Yeah, I think like for me like if we had, if we had a larger endowment, the most important thing would be that creation of community and space. And if having nicer buildings served that then cool, but like, for me, it's all about how to best pour our resource resources into our community. Right. And if having nicer buildings, med, we would have more students. But then at the same time, like, I don't want to serve a different population of people. Like I love who comes to Augsburg. I love, you know a smaller percentage of students are ready for college. More students come here from lower socioeconomic backgrounds, more students come here from, with military service. They're like, I love our student body and I wouldn't want that to change. And if all we're buildings were nicer and fancier and more attractive, you know, maybe, maybe it would seem inaccessible, maybe other people who need an opportunity to come to a wonderful education. [00:43:50] Jesse: It would just appeal to the elite. [00:43:52] Marceleen: Yeah. But it would be like our grounds to have more of a sense of community, but yeah. [00:43:58] Jesse: Okay. That's fine. That's funny. You took both those aspects and you put a incredibly positive spin on it, which actually. I'm going to adopt both of those perspectives. That's a good point. You know, I, I was going to ask you a little bit about public radio, but I want you to have, you know, be able to go at length, talking about once you get your graduate degree, what is your end goal career? [00:44:23] Marceleen: I want to be a full-time faculty member at one university, I work at for right now. And it's a lot. I want to just serve one student body. Like my, the reason I do this, the reason I teach is to empower students and I want to be able to be a full-time faculty member so that I can build connections and support students outside of the classroom, too. I want to have advisees. Support students in research. I love, I love research, but the thing I love best about it is collaborating on research and and supporting other people's work and research. And so I want to be a full time faculty member. I would love to be a full-time faculty member here. But I will look all over the country and I will go wherever I land. But yeah, I just want to serve the student student population and I'm not interested in serving I would never work at St. Thomas. I'm not interested in serving folks. And not to say every person at St. Thomas, it falls in this category, but folks who have had advantages all throughout life, nothing wrong with that. No judgment, but I'm more interested in serving folks who have had to work harder to land at a university that's who I'm interested in supporting. So, yeah, I hope to end up if not at Augsburg at a place like Augsburg or somewhere and just hoarding students doing my research teaching. [00:45:56] Jesse: That sounds exciting. How far away is that in your future? [00:45:59] Marceleen: Three to five years. My, I could technically finish up my doctorate in three years because I already have a master's. The program is five years for folks straight from bachelor's. You don't have to have a master's. But then it's a five-year program, but I don't know how long it will take me because of course I have to make enough money to like live. So I'm still adjuncting while I'm going through my PhD. So you know it'll take me about three to five years to wrap that up. And then in my last year, I'll start applying for jobs. So in theory, in five years, I could. I could be in a full-time tenure track position somewhere, but probably the students that we like I'll start applying for things in about three, three years. So, yeah. [00:46:42] Jesse: Anyway, it's awesome that we're talking about when that'll happen. Not so much, if you know. When you're going to, you know, it's like, it's there, it's like given the trajectory of your life there's no doubt you're going to get to where you want to go. It's so exciting. Yes, absolutely. I do, this is the last question. The one I'm most interested in hearing because it sounds like you've had a pretty awesome life. You gotta to be interesting, I mean, but you're also a very inspirational from what I can tell the most. And at the end, you know, when you, when you. Maybe you don't plan on retiring, but when you feel like you have to, when you do, when you, you look back on the mark, you have left what do you, what do you hope your legacy will be when people, people recall you? [00:47:26] Marceleen: I want individual people, like, I don't care about any collective appreciation of who I was in the world, but I would, I want is that individuals had that same experience that I had in education. I want to be a part of their tapestry of knowledge. Right? And so for me, my legacy might be invisible. It, people may not, my students may not remember me. They may not. That's very possible, but the ideas that I helped plant in their minds I hope grow their lives. Right? And like the most inspirational teachers for me have done from fourth grade to 10th grade to, you know, my, my associates degree and then here at Augsburg and my undergrad, like those few teachers that like. Shook me. I remember those teachers, but what they like grew in me is still flourishing and growing today. And that's what I want. Like whether students remember me or not. And it's one of those things where I may teach something in class and it may not even click for two, three years. I don't know. But my legacy I picture it like a beautiful woven, you know, kind of invisible, but like beautiful woven tapestry, just everywhere in the world, just growing ideas in, in minds. And then in a tree morals, they would be passed on to their children, that passion for learning or that passion for a communication theory or a strategy. I love teaching public speaking. And one of the reasons is that I think that so many people don't think they can speak or that they're good at speaking, or and I want the, I want folks to walk away from my class, knowing that their voice matters and that they absolutely can stand up in front of a class. Okay. At speak and they, they should, so, yeah, so that's what I want. I just want more people to feel empowered, to be better in the world. That's that's my legacy. Even nobody will probably notice. It'll just be a quiet legacy. [00:49:42] Jesse: But you know, a profound influence for the, for the better . [00:49:50] Marceleen: Little quiet, little ripples or loud who knows it might be a splash. [00:49:57] Jesse: Yeah. Well, I think that was a wonderful ending to a beautiful interview. Thank you. Thank you so much, Marceleen for being able to come in.Thank you. I mean, wonderful answers. So thank you. All right. I look forward to the rest of the semester with you.
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Title: Transcript of Oral History with Noya Woodrich, 2022
Collection: Student Projects
Search Result: 1 Natasha J 0:03 All righty, so um, my name is Natasha Johnston Brugger and today I will be interviewing Noya Woodrich. She graduated from Augsburg with her Bachelor's in 1992 and then her Master's in 1994. And now she is on the Board of Regents at Augsburg and today we'll be talking about...
Show more 1 Natasha J 0:03 All righty, so um, my name is Natasha Johnston Brugger and today I will be interviewing Noya Woodrich. She graduated from Augsburg with her Bachelor's in 1992 and then her Master's in 1994. And now she is on the Board of Regents at Augsburg and today we'll be talking about her experience as a woman student when she was at Augsburg and then also her involvement afterwards and then any other intersections that come up throughout the interview. So, for my first question, what was your experience as a student at Augsburg and why did you decide to attend Augsburg? Noya Woodrich 0:50 Well, I decided to attend Augsburg because Augsburg offers the Bachelor's in social work, and I had actually started college over at Concordia in St. Paul. But I didn't know what I wanted to major in and so when I decided on social work, I looked around to other colleges and universities in Minneapolis and St. Paul to see who offered that undergraduate and Augsburg was just one of two at that time. So, I -- that's why I transferred to Augsburg, and I will say that Rosemary Link, who's a former professor and department chair for the social work department, she was the person who gave me the tour of Augsburg the first time I came to visit and it's was really her and her tour and her description of the program and description of Augsburg that that sold me on Augsburg. And I remain in touch with her to this day, even though she's been gone from Augsburg for a while. My experience as a woman at Augsburg, um, I would say I don't necessarily think about my experience in terms of being a woman more so I think about it in terms of being a native person, and maybe a native woman. So I think in order to understand that experience, I have to say a little bit about myself in that I am Alaska Native, but even even though I was adopted and raised by a non native family. And so I grew up in central Wisconsin, in a German Lutheran community, and was not connected to my community not connected to my Native community. And so, when I came to Augsburg, I knew that that's part of what I wanted to do. And made the first step in doing that by choosing the location for my internship. When you're a social work student, you have to do an internship as a junior, and I intentionally chose to go to a Native serving organization to do my internship. And that was really my first intentional contact with my with the Native community here, my community. And so I think that that really... I knew Bonnie Wallace, who was the director of the American Indian support program at that time, and I'd met with her as an incoming Native student, but I didn't really utilize that program or the supports that offered until I was working on my master's degree. I was fortunate circumstance where my mom and dad were paying for college, so I didn't really need to worry about getting financial assistance or anything like that. And I was just becoming connected to the Native community through my internship and my work. And so I didn't necessarily need that from the American Indian support program at Augsburg. But I remember... (Pause) Social work you may or may not know is a pretty female dominant dominated field. I think it's better now in terms of the number of men that the field attracts, but back then, I think there was two guys in our social work classes, and there was probably 15 to 18 women. And so it really was my experience at Augsburg was mostly with women. And I think that that in many ways... (Pause). 2 I think back to those times when you have group discussions in class or maybe group projects. And I don't know that safe is the word but it felt like when you were not in a gender mixed group, you didn't have to, you already had some kind of gender oriented assumptions in place about each other. And so you don't need to do that. That kind of learning piece, or recognition that there were men and women at the table are part of the discussion. And then the other thing that I really valued was that most of the professors in the Social Work program are also women. And this is the early 90s. Right? So, um, well, well past those decades of our history where women had to fight for their rights as women, but not so far past the 60s and 70s and 80s, where there was still kind of these expected roles for, for women in terms of being a mother, being at home, not being a professional. And I think seeing Native- or seeing female professors, who had been in their field of choice for decades, was also good to see and women of color like Mary Anne Williams and Francine Chakolis two black women, professors at Augsburg at that time, and they'd been in their field, you know, for three, four decades. And were really strong women to look up to in terms of the social work department. And then socially, I suppose this is natural for college for that particular age. Who I surrounded myself with was all women. And I'll say Augsburg is the place where I developed those friendships, those friendships that you have for life. Um, you know, my best friend is someone from Augsburg. And I think that having that kind of sisterhood, you know, when when I was a junior there, I lived in Urness Tower, because that's where transfer students went. But when I was a senior we, there used to be these houses that you could use, they were kind of a Greek system, but not really. And so there was this one house, kind of across from Old Main, where the-the dorms are now. And there was 13 of- 13 girls that lived in that house, my senior year, it was like a three story monster house and those 13 of us that live there. And like those are still some of the best times of my life, right? Just being with women. There was one other social work major, there was a communications major, there was a business major, there was a someone who was going into art, you know, I mean, that was a really broad diversity of disciplines. And then I was the Native, and then we had a black person, and we had an Asian person. So to the extent that diversity was possible, we-we have that racial and ethnic diversity as well. And I think just both socially and professionally, still a lot of relationships that I call on from those early Augsburg days. Natasha J 9:03 Um, did you kind of feel compelled to go into social work? Because a lot of women were doing it, or did you feel like you had a choice to do kind of any degree? Noya Woodrich 9:14 Yeah, I mean, the reason it took me a year and a half of college to decide is because I felt compelled to go into every field, but social work. My dad was a social worker, and my grandmother was a social worker, and I knew kind of early on it, that's what I wanted to do. But my mom was a teacher. And both my mom and dad, neither of them were in their fields for very long. So my dad did social work for 10 years, my mom taught for like 12, but then they got into business. So they were entrepreneurs and self employed. They did real estate, auctions, 3 insurance, convenience store, you name it. And so my mom, I remember always saying you need to be -- you need to know that you're going to get a job when you graduate. That was very important to her. And so she was continually steering me towards fields that she thought I would be able to get a job in when I was done. I think looking back as a person of color, having a college degree in the early 90s, like not even a person of color as a Native person getting a college degree in the early 90s, I could have-- I could have got a job anywhere with any degree, you know, any initials behind my name, I could have got a job. Um, I don't know. I think she based her understanding of social work on my Dad's experience. And so I don't think she really understood what social work could all encompass. But it was finally halfway through my sophomore year of college, I said, I'm doing social work. That's what I've always wanted to do. And I'm going to transfer to Augusb-Augsburg, so I actually have the Social Work letters behind my name after I get my bachelor's degree. And I'm pretty sure I'll be able to get a job. And of course I did. But that was I would say that was kind of my story behind social work. Natasha J 11:21 Was there any specific class that you took that left a big impact on you? Noya Woodrich 11:26 I hardly remember the classes -- that was 30 years ago Um No, I don't think there were any classes in particular. I think there were -- I'm not going to remember her name -- she was adjunct faculty, but she taught one of my classes my senior year, of, for my bachelor's degree. And she was the first adjunct faculty I had. And the thing that I noticed about her, you know, as adjunct, adjunct faculty, you, you have a full time job doing something, and then you just teach on the side. I noticed a significant difference between her and the tenured professors at Augsburg in that she could talk about social work from like her real lived experience, right. So she was still doing social work, and teaching about it. And that I remember that being really impactful, like me noticing that about her right away, like, 'Oh, she's like, she's actually still doing this social work thing, and she knows what she's talking about.' I think I noticed that and then other things are, things I remember about classes were probably things that were semi traumatic at that point, like the public speaking, pieces of work, you know, now I can do public speaking and not even blink an eye but then, you know, as a 20, 21 year old, that was terrifying. And then in social work class, we would need to do like practice counseling sessions, where two of us would sit in the front of all of the other class members and do a sample counseling session. I remember research class being kind of scary, because that's not research is more of the sciency part of social work, and that wasn't my thing. So those are the types of things I remember I don't really remember anything more than that. I think the internships were probably what was most impactful for me. 4 I will say this was my for my master's degree. So when you do an internship, you also have a class that goes along with that. And when I did my master's degree, and I did my internship, my the instructor for the class was Karen Johnson. And her husband was a minister at a church in North Minneapolis. And I don't know what it was about her that was so appealing, but she really she really made that class that went alongside the internship feel far more valuable than any of the others before that had. And she's another one i -- she's about my mother's age, so she's in her early 80s -- and she and I still stay in touch. And her husband has passed away her son has passed away. For years at the nonprofit organization I was working at she would bring a group of students from Luther College in Iowa up to spend a day with me at our organization, so I could talk about doing social work in the native community probably did that for 15 different years, 15 different visits. So she's another one, where I, you know, I couldn't necessarily put my finger on it, but she was another female professor who had an impact in some way. One, so that I, you know, I'm still in touch with her 30 years later. Natasha J 15:38 Um, so you did talk about, like, the kind of diversity of the female students in the one house you lived with? What, um, what did you kind of notice, that's like the overall experience for, like, I guess, like the treatment of women on campus, I'm sure maybe they had some stories or other friends. Um Noya Woodrich 16:10 Well, none of my -- neither, me nor anyone in my friend group had any traumatic experiences at Augsburg in terms of being a woman and things that can happen to women. We also I would say, given that two of us were in social work, and all of the other kind of girls in that friend group or that mini network, or probably a little bit more like minded, either from a political perspective, or a social perspective. So I know we would do like because of me and the girl who were in social work, we have connections to the nonprofit organizations and different programs that they did. So I know, we would do a lot of volunteer work together. And, like, I think that's always I don't know, doing volunteer work together, I think sometimes allows you to see the best in people, right? Because it's depending on what you're doing. You kind of get a different perspective on people and how they interact with others and how they approach that type of work, the volunteer work and so I just remember that being have a significant experience. I that I don't remember. So I you know, I, you know, you hear stories about girls being raped or assaulted, sexually harassed. That wasn't my experience, that wasn't the experience of anyone in my group. And, but I also don't remember it being talked about, right, like there wasn't any class or discussion about this is how you take care of yourself as a woman, a young woman in at Augsburg and I think of note the fact that Augsburg is where it is physically located. Right. It's in South Minneapolis. And, you know, I know if I had a daughter and I were sending her to Augsburg, I'd sit down and have a conversation say, here's some tips on how to keep your safe. 5 Keep yourself safe where you're at. I don't remember anyone doing that or having that conversation. Again, I think it was probably you know, it's on the tail end of the 80s. Early 90s. People didn't talk about that stuff a ton? And if it happened to anyone else at Augsburg at the time, nobody talked about it because I don't remember it hear and I don't remember hearing about it Natasha J 19:22 Did you feel like there were any, like challenges that were unique to you as I guess a woman student but also as a Native student that you had to overcome? Noya Woodrich 19:53 So when I was working on my master's degree, I did -- that's when I need to start paying for it on my own. My parents were no longer paying for school, so I needed to figure out how to get that paid for on my own without taking out a lot of loans. And so that's what really when I went back to Bonnie Wallace with the American Indian support program and said, 'How can you help me?' and she really, she really did that she like, stepped up and provided a lot of help to me in that regard. I think my — the struggles that I had, as a Native student were actually back at Concordia, not at Augsburg and so there were a few other Native students at Augsburg. I didn't know many and there weren't any in the Social Work program. And again, my kind of contact with or integration into Minneapolis as a Native community was happening through my internship. And so I don't remember thinking a ton about being a Native person when I was at Augsburg and that might sound weird or interesting, but I kept -- and I probably still do this a little bit, honestly -- I kept, I kept my Indian friends separate from my non Indian friends. And so I would go and do things with these people I was working with a nonprofit organization where I was doing my internship, and then I would come back and I would do things with my Augsburg friends. And, and, yeah, even today I don't really mix those groups a ton. And I think that's partially recognition that there are cultural differences there. And unless I want to be in the role of teacher where I'm teaching these people how to be with these people, and then then I can bring them together, but I really, you know, I'm when you're talking about social stuff, you don't want to also be a teacher. So I don't know that that necessarily has anything to do with Augsburg, but I you know, I just really I will always be a fan of Augsburg. I think compared to Concordia like that was night and day. And that's also worked for me. I you know, I grew up like I said, I grew up in a German Lutheran neighborhood, who was Missouri Synod. And if you're familiar with the Lutheran Church Missouri Synod, it's pretty conservative. I mean, like, the church I grew up in women couldn't be part of the church council. They couldn't vote on church matters. It was really in the dark ages, if you will, and that's how Concordia was right? Like, Concordia was the Missouri Synod affiliated Lutheran Church, and it was very conservative. And here's part of why I transferred you, people who went to Concordia, were either going to be a teacher, or they were 6 going to be a minister. And so it was the women that were going to school to be teachers and the men were going to school to be ministers. And I didn't fit either of those, and I didn't fit the mold of the average student at Concordia. So that, you know, when it comes to being a Native student, and a woman for that matter, Concordia was the frame of reference, that frame of reference I was coming from, and so Augsburg was on the complete other end of the spectrum from that. And so that is the thing that's of note to me, right like that transition from a Missouri Synod affiliated college to a Evangelical Lutheran Church of America, affiliated college. And what a difference that meant, for me spiritually, as a woman, as a Native person. It was after Augsburg that I, that's when I like in finding a church home here in the Twin Cities area, went to find an ELCA church versus a Missouri Synod because I could I could see what the differences there were. I think also what social work and understanding Native issues -- like I remember, you know, when I was doing my internship that was during the Desert Storm, the Iraq War. And just thinking about that, from a different perspective, like I was always Native, but I grew up In a German Lutheran neighborhood, community and so that was the perspective that I thought about things from but as I, you know, when I came to Augsburg got exposed to my community got exposed to a different, differently, mindset of people, I think changing my thinking about social issues was really a significant part of that, that time of my life as well. Um, and, you know, I just, you know, I'll never stop supporting Augsburg like I always, you know, I'm on the Regents, I'm on the Regents for a reason, because I really care about Augsburg. I've have taught as adjunct faculty in the Social Work program, I was on the Social Work advisory board for over a decade. I just spoke in a class last week in the American Indian Studies program, I have been a speaker at you know, a number of Social Work classes, still in touch with a lot of the professors that I studied under at Augsburg even though most of them are gone. I can just never say enough about Augsburg and I think that it whether you're a woman or a person of color, or a LGBTQ or, you know, whatever the diversity might be whatever-whatever the racial or ethnic or gender identity or what have you. I think Augsburg does a really good job of creating an environment where where you can feel accepted. Now, does that mean that it's perfect all the time? No. It does not. But I think I think that Augsburg does really well in these areas compared to, because I've worked you know, I of course, got both my degrees from Augsburg, but I also attended Hamline for a while working at a doctorate degree. I've taught students from Metro State University I have supervised interns from the University of Minnesota from St. Thomas, St. Kate's, from Bethel. So I've had contact enough with other universities and colleges in the Twin Cities that if someone's considering a private option in the Twin Cities, I'll always say you should definitely look at Augsburg. Natasha J 27:43 Umm, oh, yeah, so when you were an adjunct at Augsburg? When was that? How long did you do that for? And you said it was in the social work, right? What did you teach during that time? Noya Woodrich 27:57 Um I think I taught just two classes. And I'm gonna say my son was pretty young. So it was probably the early 2000s. I'm not a fan of teaching, to be honest. I mean, I don't mind the teaching, it's all the stuff that goes along with it, like the scoring, the papers and the reading the 7 papers and entering the grades and all that stuff. And mother, much rather just will be a group, like a presenter or speaker or something like that at a class. Um, so I taught at the masters level, I taught both ends of the spectrum. So I taught the intro to social work, which is like one of the first classes that you take into masters level. And then I taught. I'm not going to remember, but it's in the PDPA. So policy development, policy analysis, PDP program development, policy and analysis, or administration, I'm sorry, PDPA, program development policy and administration. So that's one of the two concentrations in a master's program there in Augsburg and that was my constant area of concentration. And so I taught the last class in that concentration. So the students in my class, it was literally Saturday afternoon, of their last trimester of their master's degree program. I will say not the ideal time slot, because in the master's program, you're going Friday night, and then all day Saturday, so to be teaching that Saturday afternoon class, everyone was dozing off and falling asleep and, you know, like a quarter of my job was just keeping people awake for four hours, and then trying to get them to learn something But I think, you know, again, as a faculty, I think that's space to infuse my experience, and my nativeness into the teaching of those classes was really welcome. And really, I guess it was nice to have that leeway and that flexibility to do that, because it can be, I don't know how it is in other disciplines, but in social work, social work, programs need to be accredited by the Board of Social Work or by the Council of Social Work Education. And in order to be accredited, you have to really say, this is the class, these are the things that you're going to learn in this class. And this is how you're going to learn them. So it doesn't lend itself to a ton of flexibility. And so the fact that there that I was provided that flexibility in teaching and how I taught and what I taught, without straying too far from the kind of definition of the class, I think I really appreciated that. And again, I don't know that, you know, talking about women's issues in social work is probably a little hard, because it is such a female oriented field that, you know, I was most of the other faculty that I was working with were women. And let's see. So like in that particular class, there was only six students, two of them were guys and four were women. And then in the other social work class I taught it was bigger, it was more like 15 students, and there was two or three guys in there. So again, mostly dealing with women, and over the course of time, more women of color than fewer women of color. So I think as a woman doing that work, it just, it felt really supported. But I think by and large that comes because of the field as well. Natasha J 32:24 Um, Kind of like — you’re answering all my questions as I think of them in my head. It’s like you can hear my brain. Like, so, what, you kind of already talked about it a little bit, but what inspired you to join the Board, and do you feel like your perspective is adding a lot to the Board in helping out with decisions and stuff? Noya Woodrich 32:56 Um, so, Bonnie Wallace, who had been the founding director of the American Indian Support Program, uh, when she retired she came back to be part of the Board of Regents. When she was done with her term as a board, as a Regent, she helped President Pribbenow find some replacements and I was one of two Native people that she reached out to. And I’ll say it was 8 always something that I was interested in, but I didn’t think that I’d ever rise to the level of becoming a Regent for Augsburg or for anywhere else. Because it is a, it can be a bit of a prestigious position I guess. I maybe see that differently now that I am a Regent. So it was, like I was, like they couldn’t even get the question all the way out of their mouth. I’m like, yep, nope. And I think I ticked a couple boxes too, right? I’m Native. I’m Lutheran. And that’s, you know, being Lutheran is part of what they look for in Regents. Not across the board, but um, they do need to have so many Lutheran people on the Board. So yeah, I quickly agreed to do it. It is one of those boards, and I’ve been part of Boards of Directors for nonprofit organizations that are like this where there is a lot of people with a lot of money. I’m not. Right, I’m not. I’m a social worker. I don’t have money. Not a lot of it. Certainly not millions of dollars to contribute to the construction of whatever building is being constructed at the time. So in that way, I would say that I feel a little bit out of my league because I just know I’m sitting next to someone who has the capability of writing out a million dollar check. I don’t know what that feels like. But I think where —so the committees that I sit on are Student Affairs and then like Marketing and Enrollment. And I think, like I think of those marketing and enrollment committee meetings. Every time we have a meeting and they present their numbers about who’s applied, where are they in the process of being enrolled, how are they gonna be accepted, are they enrolled, you know, all of those different kind of measures that, uh, that team of people tracks. Um, I’m always the one that says, “okay, and how are you doing with people of color?” So, you, you’re telling us you have really good enrollment numbers, how many of those students are people of color? And then ask the same question when we talk about retention of students because I know that even from an employment perspective a place can be really good at hiring people of color it’s another thing for them to be able to hang on to people of color. Likewise with students we can do really good at recruiting students of color to Augsburg but if we’re not doing what it takes to get them to stay there then we’re still missing the (inaudible) in some ways. I think being there and asking that question at every single meeting just as a reminder to the staff and everybody else on the committee that we can’t just look at enrollment we need to look at enrollment and dig down into that to figure out what are we doing to recruit more students of color and hang onto them at Augsburg. I think that with the student affairs similarly going to the chair of that committee and saying hey I think it would be helpful for us to hear from the American Indian Support Program or any of the other kind of support programs that take place to say what are you, do you have the resources that you need in order to do what you need to do to keep our students of color here at Augsburg. And then I don’t know that I had anything to do with it, pretty sure I didn’t, but the fact that it happened while I’m on the Board of Regents and that is the move to pay for tuition for Native students in totality. I’ll take a little bit of credit for that just because I’m on the Regents right now. That’s amazing that a private university would take that step to, um, fully support Native students to attend Augsburg. That’s, um, that’s a rare thing. And it’s certainly uh trendsetting for Augsburg to do that both here in Minnesota and across the country. And it makes me really proud that the place that I chose to get my higher education would do that. Unfortunately, while I don’t make a ton of money, I make just enough that my son won’t be able to take advantage of that offer at Augsburg. Um, that doesn’t mean I’m not going to try to get him to go there anyhow. And I think, I think that there are enough people of color on the Board of regents. There’s three of us native people and then there’s some other folks of color. I think 9 there’s enough of us that collectively we can remind the others that there’s different ways we need to think about this, these issues as a board of regents whether we’re talking about enrollment, or how much to charge for tuition in the upcoming year, or how to support student affairs groups, how to support the faculty of the university, how to support the staff, or the adjunct faculty of the university. I think all of those things — that augsburg is unique in many ways and a lot of that comes from augsburg’s commitment to doing things the way they’ve done them for a lot of years. And that’s really significant and I think that if I play any little role in ensuring that augsburg continues to having a commitment to the non-average person, right? the diversity, to the, um, racial and ethnic differences of its student body and faculty, then, um, that’s good, I’ll keep asking the questions and making people think about things. Natasha J 40:21 And then is there any advice that you’d give to current female students at Augsburg? Noya Woodrich 40:36 I’ll say the same thing I said when I was talking to that class last week. I think one of the number one things that I can, that has helped me to be as successful as I am — and I consider myself successful in my career; I’ve accomplished a lot, I’ve done a lot, I’ve risen the ladder, if you will. I think the number one thing that’s contributed to that is the relationships that I've developed over the years. and like i was saying earlier many of those date back to augsburg whether those be my friendships or my professional relationships I think that having a network of people that you can call on in almost any circumstance in your career, your life, is really, really important. So, if I were to say anything to younger folks out there that are maybe getting started it would be that. take time to invest in your relationship building because those relationships will help carry you far. Natasha J 41:59 Was there anything that I didn’t ask you that you want to talk about still? Noya Woodrich 42:06 I don’t think so. You had some good questions there. Natasha J 42:13 Yeah. Well, I don’t have any other burning questions either. Um, thank you so much for doing this interview with me. You had some really great insights. I’m just gonna stop the recording and then we can, I can just — First 30 min transcribed with otter.ai, and last 12 min are my own transcription.
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Title: Transcript of Oral History with Muamer Pezerovic, 2022
Collection: Muslims in Minnesota Oral History Project
Search Result: Amina Pezerovic 0:00 Today is Sunday, April 17 2022. I'm Amina Pezerovic, from Augsburg University in Minneapolis, Minnesota. I'm here doing an oral history interview with Muamer Pezerovic in Maple Grove Minnesota. This interview is for the Muslims in Minnesota project. When were you born a...
Show more Amina Pezerovic 0:00 Today is Sunday, April 17 2022. I'm Amina Pezerovic, from Augsburg University in Minneapolis, Minnesota. I'm here doing an oral history interview with Muamer Pezerovic in Maple Grove Minnesota. This interview is for the Muslims in Minnesota project. When were you born and what do you remember from your childhood? Muamer Pezerovic 0:24 I was born on May 17 1973. And from my childhood I have only the best memories that I can have and wish anybody to have a childhood like I did what can I say you know the growing up you know it was just without worries everything was provided by my family you know they had lots of friends and like I said I didn't we didn't have any worries growing up you know we were just enjoying it like supposed to be for every kid in the world. Amina Pezerovic 1:08 what was it like growing up in Bosnia Muamer Pezerovic 1:11 growing up in Bosnia well it was like I said my childhood was really nice you know and growing up as a teenager I had lots of friends lots of cousins you know people on a usual basis you know that we besides the school and everything you know, we grow up close to the lake and we enjoy the summers doing so many things you know because that that age you know, he was main thing to find something you know to practice as a football, basketball sports sailing sports you know, the we had so many opportunities to do over there and that's what we spend our time you know growing up with a friends and like I said going through cafes restaurants you know, the Bosnia that time was Pro- Western country you know that everything that you could listen any kind of music in United States you could listen automatically in Bosnia at that time and there was no prohibition or whatever you know, it was one wonderful life you know that you can imagine you know, I didn't I didn't remember anything anything wrong at that time you know, that's what was going on you know? What should I say everything lasted you know, till the war started in Bosnia but like that you know, that was my memories that everybody enjoyed it Amina Pezerovic 3:05 was your family very religious what religious experiences do you remember having when you were young Muamer Pezerovic 3:12 Yes, my family especially my mom she was very religious and even today you know growing up you know, everybody from our part of the town you know, that where we used to live was going to beside the regular school, we were going to school next to the mosque, you know, that we could have some basic education and wacky we can pray and whatever whatever comes with that, you know, but yeah, the religious experiences that I remember you know, it was growing up are beautiful experiences, you know, that the people you know, that especially, when the Ramadan is there and the people are fasting and you can feel human today people are preparing in in a bakeries, you know, special bread, you know, that we call Lepine, you know, that they're preparing you know, when they want to break the fast people were waiting in lines, you know, just for a half an hour just to get that bread, you know, fresh and, and hot, you know, and then when you get it, you know, you run home and trying to break the fast you know, and yeah, those those things are staying over there. You know, the people were very respectful, especially the Ramadan, you know, when when to each other, you know, in Ramadan, it's there, you know, data That's seriously. And yeah, then we had other people coming sapphires, we call them those are visitors people that they were coming from other cities, you know, to our hometown, you know, and we try to provide for them the best experience they needed. And yeah, all that stuff, you know, the bring the people together. And people were happy at that time and I know I was happy Amina Pezerovic 5:38 What was your experience coming to and living in Minnesota as a Muslim Muamer Pezerovic 5:44 experience coming to Minnesota, you know, first time when I came here I came thanks to my friends today used to live here in the land. The promise promised me you know, that it's going to be much easier to find a job here and no, I didn't have any other family, you know, some friends, you know, and the first thing the first time I came here was not that much. Thinking where and what do you know? Because as a Muslim, you can pray in your own apartment you can be pray, you don't need to be in a mosque or something No. to be. But yeah, it's a kind of later on, you know, after some while, you know, then when I see we had a something new, like a Muslim community from Bosnia that time was not that big. And people were kinda for meeting each other, you know, just when it's a bigger Eid Mubarak or for Ramadan, or even for Eid Adha and other holidays. So let's see it, you know, but yeah, that we were renting space, you know, just to pray at that time, because we didn't have that big organization, you know, like some other countries for me, he's you know, but step by step, you know, people start organizing and we could we were able to thanks to the generous donations from other people to buy the building and open the open the Islamic center and over Bosnian people here in Minnesota. And yeah, it's it's kind of that was a kind of feeling it's not, you know, you left everything behind, it was just five minutes walk, you know, to every mosque in Bosnia, you know, where you live in Orange here, calm, you don't see that it was a little bit confusing, but you're worried, you know, how to survive here first, you know, that was a thing that you concentrate, you know, to provide for a family on the first place and everything for yourself. And thanks to Allah, you know, we kinda, we kinda did that other thing, too, you know, we open up the mosque, you know, and now people have a place to go to pray, you know, in our own language, you know? Amina Pezerovic 8:25 And did you ever feel disconnected from Assam while living in Minnesota? No, never. Muamer Pezerovic 8:30 You can never be if your true believer you cannot be disconnected. No matter where you come, you know, where you go. If you carry that in your heart. If you carry shahada, it's in your heart. Amina Pezerovic 8:45 What did your community look like in Minnesota and where they muscling? Muamer Pezerovic 8:51 Well, hold my friends, you know, on the beginning, you know, when I came here, normally, there were Muslims, you know, and some people from ex Yugoslavia, you know, that I met, you know, some Christ's Serbs, you know, you met them, you know, but most of them, they were Muslims, you know, and they hang out, you know, but at work, you know, I work with all kinds of people, you know, the people, Latinos, you know, Americans, everybody, you know, and normally cooking in front of them, you know, for so many years. You have friendships through it, you know, all kinds of people. Sometimes we talk about religion, even if it's a different, different view or something, we just talked about it and that was the main main part of it, you know, that they were people, freedom of speech that you can say, What do you think and what do you what do you carry in the other person also, you understand our main main thing is, there was there was a kind of thing that carry on, you know, every day, I met so many people that they impressed me and that they're going to stay with me all my life, you know, how generous and how, how honest and nice people, you know, sometimes you lose that feeling that those people don't exist, and all of a sudden they show up, they just Yeah, but like I said, you know, most of the people that I had for friends, we were visiting as a family and I recall, you know, the Bosnia, Bosnian family, they come back to us, and that was the kind of thing that, and beside the work, you know, you couldn't, you couldn't do that much, you know, as we used to do, like in Bosnia, or something, you know, here was a priority thing was just to support your family, that was the number one rule in order to provide that they have a place to stay sleep, they eat, they have everything to eat, and, and normally, you know, if you have a time for fun, and you go out with your friends, and you have fun, you know, but yeah, that's the that's the kind of thing that like I said, that community, you know, but it grows, it grows, you never know who you're going to meet every day. And I hope it's just the honest and nice person. Amina Pezerovic 11:29 Yeah. How did you practice your faith in a new country in a state that didn't have a huge Bosnian Muslim community? Muamer Pezerovic 11:39 Well, you know, as a, as a Muslim, you know, when you come in, if you don't have a place to go a mosque, or masjid or, you know, you always have your home, you just need to know, which side to turn, you know, where is the mecca, you know, and that's where return and just pray at home, you know, pray, or it was that time, you know, I remember when I first time came here to United States, you when I came to Minnesota, we had a mosques, you know, that they were built by the people that they came from Saudi Arabia, or, or Lebanon or, you know, and that's what we did on the beginning, you know, if we're going there and trying to, you know, you go over there you pray, because every mosques you know, mosque, it's a, it's a house of the guard, you know, and especially for, for holidays, you know, for a middle fifth remedial at her aid, you know, we were going you know, definitely, by that time, but otherwise, you know, we stay at home, pray as much as you can, you know, as much times allows you and, yeah, that will be Amina Pezerovic 13:11 what were turning points in your religious life. Were they early in life or more recently? Muamer Pezerovic 13:17 Well, turning points, you know, like I said, before, you know, growing up, you know, first of all, first thing that I remember, you know, like a little kid and I was going to my grandpa, and we were kind of all the family members, you know, like he was like five, six, maybe even 10 kids you know, we were going there and then we were practicing in front of him. Surrahs , you know, that's you have to learn and you have to learn how to do the solid you know, and and basic things you know, that religion gives you an all and besides that we were going to mosque you know, that we had to finish the school, you know, in front of the Imam you know, which I did, you know, I was maybe I finished hotma we call it you know, when you read the whole Quran when I was about 14 years old, and you have to do that in front of everybody in a mosque, you know, that was a graduation for us. Yeah, but the thing is, you know, the religion you know, growing up like that you don't think seriously about it, you know, you just do something because your parents asked you to do and but the main point, you know, in a religion that that was, I was affected, you know, I was when I was in a camp during the war in Bosnia, you know, when I was faced with faced with the deaths, you know, that It's that the only thing that I remember that I said the academy shahada because I was ready. I was ready to leave this world and everything you know and I said Ashburn La Ilaha illa Allah wa Ashkelon the Muhammad Rasul Allah, like, as every, every Muslim should say, before he leaves this world. And that was it something you know, that you carry. And I was always fascinated, you know, that, how in that situation person can stay so calm and so so brave, you know, that you just don't even move you say, This is it, this is well of God, you know, and this is, and but thanks to the gods, we stay, here we are 30 years after he, you know, with a beautiful family and, you know, and we just, we have to be in life, we have to be grateful, you know, and just pray, pray for other people, that they stay alive and healthy. And, you know, that's that will be Yeah. Amina Pezerovic 16:17 What do you think is often misunderstood about Muslims in Minnesota, Bosnian Muslims? Muamer Pezerovic 16:25 Won't even generally, you know, the people don't understand, don't understand some things, you know, they talk about something, but they didn't even educate themselves, you know, to talk about people and what's happening in the east over there, what's happening here, generally, you know, the, putting all people in one, one pot, that's, that's, that's not correct, you know, and everything what happens over there, you, you bring the Muslims in 9111, like I said, the place everybody, you know, and people should be more educated, you know, the latter people here in other states, they don't even know about Islam, you know, they should, my view is, you know, just they should study more and see what's all about, you know, and when you do that, then it will be much better understanding that Islam is the religion of peace, you know, and people are, people are so nice and kind to each other, and you cannot put, like I said, if somebody does something, some want to say, yes, it's like a terrorist or somebody does something, you know, that, you know, you cannot put hold people together in that, you know, it happens from every side, you know, it's not only for Muslims, even Catholics or Jewish or everybody has a some kind of people that are extreme, that it can commit something, you know, that you cannot generalize, you know, everybody with that, and that's the only thing you know, I think that people have a lack of education about Islam, you know, and once they do that, they then they understand better you know, what's going on? And I think they have more respect for Muslims. Amina Pezerovic 18:27 What are your experiences with Muslims of other ethnicities and races? Muamer Pezerovic 18:33 Well, I met so many people here in Minnesota, you know, especially, you know, working at the restaurant, you know, I could that was able to meet some people you know, from Somalia from 83. from Lebanon, Palestine, which country in the world you know, Turkey normally, you know, when the Yeah, it's all one thing, it's in common, you know, those people are nice smiling as salaam alaikum, my brother or you know, it's a kinda you know, you can see that it's happiness and on their faces, you know, that they don't mean anything bad to other person. You know, but like I said, people just want a good life, you know, for for their families and for themselves and normally for others, you know, and help your neighbor like, like you said, Help, and it's gonna Good thing it's gonna return to you, you know, and that's the that's the main thing I think in life, you know, just try to help try to help everybody around you and all those people, you know, that I met there was so nice You know, we could find, we could find together, you know, we could talk about the religion, we could talk about other stuff in life, you know, and all the time if they were leaving and say, Oh, inshallah brother You know, it's gonna be you know how the Allah tell it's gonna be for us you know and yeah but when nothing then just the good experiences you know Amina Pezerovic 20:30 what role does Islam play in your life and now? Muamer Pezerovic 20:35 Well, Islam hates the way, way of life, you know, just it's a big roll, big rolling, especially people when they get older, you know, they're gonna turn more to word religion in everything you know, and besides the work that we do here and everything, you know, it's not an excuse, you know, but now it's getting better, you know, hopefully, you know, we try even with the kids, you know, to teach him to keep it and later on, you know, to carry on, you know, that big thing, big thing and nine in a life that can lead you if you if you follow the rules of Islam, you know, you're going to be on the right path. You know, and you're going to be nice person, first of all, you know, after that, you know, it's everything else. But hopefully, hopefully, in the future, you know, we just, we're gonna try, we're gonna try even more doing that we do now, you know, and Islam, it's the best cure for everybody and all especially psychologically, you know, if you do that, you know, and you pray every day, then it's gonna bring you down in this difficult times in audits that everybody is experiencing in order. Everything around us, you know, the wars going on, and people are so worried about stuff, you know, but you need to have a something you have to need. You have to keep the faith and don't lose hope. And the hope is everything. If you lose hope, and you lose everything. That's what I learned from my experience. But like I said, Yeah, it's Islam plays plays a big role. You know, we try to keep it as much as much as we can, you know, we can always do much more and better. But that's, that's the, that's the thing. You know, when it clicks, it clicks, you know, sometimes you cannot push it. If you push it too much, sometimes people burn. You cannot overdo it, you know, and hopefully, everything is gonna be okay. And hopefully my family you know, and the kids you know, they're gonna carry on, carry on, you know, whatever we left, you know, to them and that will be the main idea that they find the truth. And and, what else could be said? Transcribed by https://otter.ai
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Title: Transcript of Oral History Interview with Ruhel Islam, 2022
Collection: Muslims in Minnesota Oral History Project
Search Result: Ruhel Islam Muslims in Minnesota Interview Fri, 4/1 7:53PM • 1:31:22 SUMMARY KEYWORDS people, food, community, growing, called, america, sylhet, pandemic, restaurant, bangla, area, bangladesh, minnesota, problem, turmeric, muslim, fish, bangladeshi, culture, burned SPEAKERS Ruhel Islam, Mah...
Show more Ruhel Islam Muslims in Minnesota Interview Fri, 4/1 7:53PM • 1:31:22 SUMMARY KEYWORDS people, food, community, growing, called, america, sylhet, pandemic, restaurant, bangla, area, bangladesh, minnesota, problem, turmeric, muslim, fish, bangladeshi, culture, burned SPEAKERS Ruhel Islam, Maheen Zaman, Emily Emily 00:00 All right. Today is Friday, April 1 2022. I'm Emily from Augsburg University in Minneapolis, Minnesota. I'm here with Professor Maheen Zaman of the history department doing an oral history interview on Ruhel Islam on Zoom. This interview is for the Muslims in Minnesota project. So my first question for you Ruhel, is where and in which year you were born and can you tell us a little bit about what it was like growing up in Bangladesh? Ruhel Islam 00:34 Yes, I was born in a village called Bahar Mardan in Bangladesh. Which is the called Sylhet previously Assam were part of the you know Assam. Assam is very famous for tea garden and its a lot of tea garden. so from then 1976 October 1. When I was growing up, you know I grew up in a closed-loop food system which is opposed to some, like a so it's like a joint family; happy everyone celebrating each other you know my mom use to cook food so all people come eat holiday or I. one of the most memorable stuff like when I was probably eight years old and Bangladesh was almost under the water 1988 flood and whole town was under the water or our village was there under the water, was hosting a lot of other people from the town so okay, why? because we had a like a closed loop for system we grew up we don't depend on transportation for our food so this is what culture I grew up in food is very food always bring people together anything any celebration about the food even some people die we celebrate with the food you know like these how food is very important for you know for us whenever we're growing up it's very important Yeah, Maheen Zaman 02:17 the same flood our first floor was flooded it did were to take a local little boat to go enough distance the dendritic Orisha to go to school but yes they still in the water but we didn't have all the food the catabolic I used to come to us and sell it the first floor because we couldn't go anywhere all the whole city was underwater Dhaka yet wow how large was your family? And did you move around within Sylhet or were you always in like our we have the name movie buzzer all the time in New York City a lot of people from movie buzzer is that close to where you were? -1- Transcribed by https://otter.ai Ruhel Islam 02:57 Yeah yeah very close to the town Bahar Mardan is very famous for a lot of other reason already lead by example for whole district whole Sylhet terms of either leading and the politics leading and you know, any revolutionary staff in all without someone for village for familiar was no like a part of it. But yes, I moved in a Sylhet again and I go around you know, I when I will say what is the childhood memories a lot of memories like a very happy that's brings you he cannot tell story again. And again. It's too much stuff to say. The Flood was important because when I see people come together, have conversation and dialogue. And that time 1988, our elder, Hindu, Muslim, all we came together anything we all work together shoulder to shoulder and they're talking about climate change. Just happened I was scared. They said I heard this Bangladesh will go under the water you know, these are the story they taught long time ago. And now you know science telling like a sea sea level rising up, you know, but this is what people know long time ago. And that's why you know a lot of people out of country a lot of people is the climate refugees. A lot of people displaced their, from their hometown or under the water they went to Dhaka. Dhaka like a 16 17 million people. And again, if you think about what is experience I wake up here in the morning I say thanks to Allah hamdulillah thanks god I'm here because no matter what you know, we wake up and thinking what we can do make it better for other people you know, because our action impact other people life. And you should think that way sometime you know, I always like talk to I'm in the community like a we, when I first came to Minnesota, I came with as stranger, me and my brother, then we build community, we are no more stranger anymore. So these are we will come to why? Because what you see around here that's a reflection of my native culture. My growing up with like a giant family culture I grew up in a community and growing up in a lot of sisters, we grow a lot of sisters, you know, we are two brothers, and all five sisters and cousins, all this is like a best thing like a you. There's a we care about each other care about art. And also, you know, whenever I was little boy my mom is to teach us, like, you know, when we go play outside or maybe hit that tree or try to make digging for unreason, on the soil, this is a no you have to make sure that treat the way used to be treated treat your soil right, your plants, right, these are helping, you know, so Islam, when we're growing up, you know, we didn't learn from the book from our community can come together, any problem will come together, have conversation and dialogue and solve the problem. And that's the culture you know, I grew up in I bringing me here. And I'll tell you, when I become a US citizen. During the oath ceremony, life changing and other stuff, jazz said, We want you to bring your culture don't forget your culture. That was around 2008. And after that, what do you see here? You know, it's opens up like I have my license in a telling a Bangla guy gotta bring your culture means good, okay, what is it my culture, the food culture, I just share with you, and in both this culture, and we build a community for last 12 years, that in Yes, in this Longfellow area, and from our experience growing up in, in culture, or under a mother in leadership, so we learn a lot of things and they help us now lead by example, you know, hear that those those teaching, helping us anyway, go, you know, just bring it be who you are. And just, you know, and of course, anything you have to have a dream. Everyone wants to come to America, that was kind of American dream. And I was inspired by so many other stuff. Another thing like watching the 18, fall guy, the MacGyver X flies, you know, go culprit get caught America, you know, that was like, oh, man, maybe you get justice. Maybe 100 years later, we get justice in America, that was we are you know, thinking forward, the oh, we go America freedom, like a freedom of speech, we don't really get everything. And another thing is the economic reason to one of my main reason to I decided to come to help my mom, my mom, my mother, salaam, help people, she's very spiritual in the octave all the time. And I says in how I can, you know, support my mom to people, there's one of the, -2- Transcribed by https://otter.ai you know, difference I see she's to like a, you know, in our, our village, our family, our mother become finance minister, or grandmother or mother, like all the generation mothers to become a leader or finance minister of that family, in a decision making them like a real leader is why I remember also, you know, my mother is to say, you have to educate yourself educated mother can create educated society educated community that was again to me about that, and they're very spiritual lady, but they also talking about learn, like acknowledge, like, yes, you have to learn how to deal with the data. So I'm here you know, I'm bringing those bills and having How are we doing it through with the restaurant I had before burned down through community work, bring people together doing a lot of unique stuff like idea is closeable for system is a wonderful thing, you know? Maheen Zaman 09:39 So related to the restaurant, what was your favorite food growing up in Bangladesh? In the 80s or 90s, like growing up. Ruhel Islam 09:50 my favorite food was actually Dal in a dal bhat. Dal is something you know, you come to curry or find out I go anywhere, I take the dal. And dal every day and I still cry for Dal because sometimes going up in a big familiy the dal become real soupy watery. You know, I don't like that I like that thick down like go no dal. And I'm also cooking it here same dal. I go anywhere dal must fight that. Dal and this is what I learned, you know, can alu bhaaji we have a Mookie something. These are like in our village growing in our land. Potato Mookie, which is what is Mookie is English like some kind of root? Maheen Zaman 10:38 Kochu. Kochu Kochu. Let's but they haven't been Asian stores. I just Ruhel Islam 10:47 Yeah, I just had it today. I went through I said like the stuff we grew up with in Sylhet. And then you know, on February stuff because sometimes when you feel sick there is a different February's tab there's to put 512 Different kinds of spinners together. That's called Banerji or Bharata share, like and cook together with shing match like a fish and good for your health when you don't feel good. So we learn of medicinal food but also when we inhale it that was become favored. Oh when I get sick to get this food you know? Because like there are some favorite stuff like this. The flavor inside those are usually very we don't we can get I try to get those flavors sometime. But you can't get it here. Maheen Zaman 11:44 The catfish catfish some of them Ruhel Islam 11:45 catfish a small catfish. This is like a natural ones. So good. So dalysate dal and alu alu bhaaji Albertina these are these are my favorite stuff and these are for the food security 1988 flood how we. There was a food shortage. How we handle food shortage that time I see in my uncle my family, Oh everyone growing potato everyone growing potato excuse me sir by there my son just walking everyone this is the everyone growing potato and Mookie kochu and stuff I recording for live or just for your assignments. -3- Transcribed by https://otter.ai Maheen Zaman 12:37 This is just for the audio the video or Ruhel Islam 12:39 the audio okay again yeah you know like kochu that that like a very popular stuff then you go catch fish from your, we had a pond in the front and pond in the back. So we go catch fish when you're hungry go catch a fish. and it 2012 by two, University of Minnesota student group over there on sustainability hosted Oh 22 students from here every year I take some delegation last couple of years because of Coronavirus and other problem you know in a table so they always go long okay leaving the sustainability there. So these are these value I want to do eat here and it is why we started you know when it comes back? Yeah, we did. Gandhi garden and other stuff. Emily 13:27 Yeah. So going off of you said that you tried to get some ingredients for some of the food. Um, I kind of want to hear about how the transition was coming to America because I know we don't have like the same ingredients. The culture is slightly different. So I'd like to hear how like you said the flood kind of motivated you to come here. I just like to hear about your coming to America story. Ruhel Islam 13:53 Again, okay. Thank you for putting me in that track. These are Bangla people will start talking you know, we go from one site to another site so one of the of course, you know, there is a political reason you know economic reason. There was a political problem. When you were growing up in a watching people striking actually political problem was enough for our country. The big problem - excuse me one second, I'm just gonna see if I can get a kid back to your mom. Continue those story from that hacker? Maheen Zaman 14:40 So how did you come to America? For me it was my father was in Saudi Arabia gulf war happens you will for George Islam, it didn't work. My mother played Obi Wan and we got the visa and that's how we came to New York. So I have this story. So we would like to know what your journey and the stories were. The context that motivated you. Who was here to receive you? Why Minnesota because it's it is either London or New York and I've never heard of Minnesota Ruhel Islam 15:05 Yeah. So when I say like in my mother you know she like to apply one I want to see like, oh she have to comply we know other people to help this to that devices you don't why should you have to ask how go? This I tried to become self sufficient very early age. But 1996 I came to America actually right after the political change happened, you know, and we have a too much stuff going on over there. So, I came as a like, I got my visa, my sister got married to American businessman, you know, my brother in law, then I got visit visa, I came, then I take this out, you know, my opportunity came, I came to New York, New York. Then, my father said, don't come back, you know. Good you're going there because a problem is getting worse and worse political problem. So, that time was. I decided to stay back because of the political reason, there was no I was involved with politics. Because when I was in high school, I participated in Lautoka government like a movement as you know, brother Mines iman knows probably -4- Transcribed by https://otter.ai 88 A shot autocratic government and one of our student leaders got killed then you all walk out I remember from the school and then we you know, defeated the autocratic government and then categoric government came, but we are not freedom yet. When the country from you know, I came here another reason to make a difference from here speak out and tell people you know, this is why we are doing this why I'm involved in US politics to make it better in the world. We as immigrant we understand the problems you know, any problem because one of the problem we are facing here in America, we are survivor of those problems. Having a recent problem was Coronavirus problem we survived Dingo fever, barely survived malaria, cholera, typhoid, chicken pox, everything you know. Then that experience also we have watching you know how to survive from this thing then you know in then we have it like it I'm gonna move forward to American life right now right? I mean, I'm in American life now. Okay, Maheen Zaman 17:44 so 1996 you're in New York, New York ok did you come here with like to be to study a lot of people come to study Ruhel Islam 17:52 in New York then I took right after my college actually I went to a first college and I was up my auntie wanted me to go in the army. When I wanted to be involved in the Maheen Zaman 18:04 Bangladeshi cadet school, Josiah shine Ruhel Islam 18:07 Yeah Bangladeshi our first cause in Bangladesh. Yeah, then I came then I decided to stay back I stayed back 2000. You know, till I got married I found my wife. They arranged so I got married. Then I was not happy in New York because it's a cultural shock and first thing is first thing I feel I came in heaven because when when I was lending every line last day of snowing happening or coming down coming out from a track I feel like they say Heaven or something like is so good feeling. I didn't know this I get another shock. Wow first time live snow Emily 18:55 and then you come to Minnesota where we have more snow? Yeah, Ruhel Islam 18:58 that I cold you know cold is actually Minnesota. I found Minnesota because I was saying like when I came to America, I giving an apartment in Manhattan. Looks like I'm living in a jail. We call packing buckshot. mojego like our our chicken house were bigger than their apartment. You know Maheen Zaman 19:22 where this where Manhattan there was a north or south? Ruhel Islam 19:26 -5- Transcribed by https://otter.ai I live in Greenwich Village area. Downtown and you know they have a nice apartment by Medina Motion by where they are more 64th Street. Yeah, yeah, the four between second and first avenue Fourth Street. You know first they came there for Emily's Maheen Zaman 19:42 reference. Remember we learned about in the 20s and 30s. A lot of people from Bengal jumped ship and they create a Bengali Muslim community in Lower East Side and some of them assimilated into black and Puerto Rican community. But there's a mosque there. My father took me there. His first bond the masjid and it was there NYU. Now that area is like you know, all gentrified and rich people and people How did this mosque come about? Because well it used to be a community here. People come in and merchant marines and ships in the 50s 60s and they live there Ruhel Islam 20:15 yeah so you're right you know that area my grandfather in law which is first came ship from Sylhet and he participate in the World War II, he was one of the first Bangladeshi world war two veteran, you know, few of them came in they never got back they died here and never go back. But they were like a generation came that brought all their my wife said people slowly slowly was able to give people bliss. I don't know that time that something is if it's a process that time come in the border ship, okay, get a certificate something, then is to people who say give them like a house, or I have a apartment give anyone the $200 apartment rent, you know, $300 and a lot of people still pay the $500 rent because of the kind of help put him in all those kind of rent control whatever it is, they still have people where is $1,000 apartment, but they're still using like a during the war, World War, you know, lease with some policy in New York. And then I came to Minnesota, my brother came first. I'm coming to Minnesota, then I start. I said 10,000 city of lakes and rivers 10,000. The country I'm coming from this also country of lake and river, the Sylhet that village of the Sylhet I mean, or high lower area, you know, so I feel like I found my home. And South Minneapolis, people are, you know, welcoming, very welcoming, I try to see some people you know, I do a lot, a lot of fun stuff, but I always take everything is a positive. So I don't suffer, you know, like, there is a different kind of problem happening around the area. But I just take it very, I'm very positive. I say no, I don't really pay attention just going to be move forward I know what my, you know, dream is and stuff. But I remember. So, when first I opened the restaurant in 2000 and. We started 2005 actually at that small dinky dome area food court area by the University of Minnesota, called the Tasman covenant, very insight. Then we suffer I don't wanna say suffer but there was some news that came in that building you know those things, but they took advantage as an immigrant that and I was new, then 2008 when I came to Longfellow area I found this place and you know, that time was very important for me to what I'm seeing what I'm facing like a people don't trust each other Middle East are people you know, like a Muslim or not trusted like it, people are fitting better each other then I get time I found like, that area Longfellow area, all the peace sign everywhere. Peace sign peace, I know why against why then I say Oh, this is how we have to bring people together. And as I found the home and lake, river, everything, all positive stuff. Then we started restaurant fine dining in 2008. And you know, one of the main thing to unite people and rename after Gandhiji because Gandhiji is a leader for our you know, like in India everywhere during that time. And my grandfather, during the Assam time, Assam fighters Buddhist time, my grandfather, you know, when Gandhi came to our district, he was in this meeting with him. There was a inspiration. I ran about from my uncle book when he wrote, so those are the inspiration I said, How can we this is the time How can you bring -6- Transcribed by https://otter.ai people together? You know, and maybe use Gandhi's name and being a, you know, like a diverse group of people together. That time was a good idea to do this to get people together. Because sometime you know, my name like my last name is Islam. And that time I put my PR says put Ruhelji, you know, really Gandhiji really, that try to make the case to the community that I was stranger. That people slowly know about my culture Oh is a Muslim guy Islamic culture was very welcoming. Then I slowly and I share all the culture, studying, doing like a halal meat, season with kosher salt, vegetarian, non vegetarian and vegan. I invited people when I say Everyone is welcome. It's my Imam. It's my belief that I have to make sure that everyone is welcome. So we started inviting in a diet, come on the same table, and have conversation and dialogue and talk about everything, you know, what do you face. And slowly that's this is what through this restaurant to this community building thing. You know, we build a whole community I am no more stranger. Maheen Zaman 25:29 Did you move before or after 9-11 to Minnesota from New York? Ruhel Islam 25:34 I moved, actually after 9-11 after 9-11. Maheen Zaman 25:38 So you were in New York City? Ruhel Islam 25:39 I was in I mean, I was coming back and forth from 2000 to 2005. I did not like a back and forth, I just my brother here, I get married, I'm going to Bangladesh, my father died. My mother long sick. So when my father says, you know, when I come, don't come back, I never got to see him again. Because he died in Cambodia, you know, so I never able to go back I was in, I don't have a visa to go back that time because I was in a process, you know, visa. So this is like a set barrier to sacrifice on a small team, to water water to come here. You know, make your life be somebody and you know, not only your own life, make the world a better place. And I found working through this restaurant, you know, was I was it almost like a 12 years of building community to this restaurant and coming to work. And bringing culture no more stranger. People don't afraid of me. They're not afraid of my beard anymore. They know, our culture is wonderful. Maybe we look different, maybe, you know, we do things differently. Maybe we pray five times. But these are not a bad thing. So I was able to make the case and people are very welcoming about it, they will start participating. So that's why we did that. Our demo and them and I, they collaborate them to interfaith dinner. If they're blocked by invite everyone tell everyone like a what is iftar. Educate everyone and one thing I did first time I went to jump into that room. And I did call for prayer Adhan. Today adhan is official in No, they're doing it. We started from there out is no did it and everyone came pay attention sometime. Here people pay very good attention. Look at your respect. You know, this is what I really like about even now our culture if we go after our Bangladesh in our when we talk to people for interfaith people, they were very silently listening. They're listening like a with respect everything this is a very wonderful thing. And there's nothing new to ask you to me because we grew up in this kind of culture you know, Hindu Muslim, I buy extra paper go to the chai accettare patch Salah Jai you know we do all this work together any problem we work together and this -7- Transcribed by https://otter.ai is what I was able to teach our share with our community here in Minneapolis I believe communities with any sort of, you know, yeah, Emily 28:21 um, I noticed that you're you said like you built this community and you're really involved in like educating people. And I also noticed that you said like, your mother taught you how to like respect the soil and nature. I'm just wondering how that journey started towards sustainability and encouraging sustainability and how that's integrated into your restaurant as well. Ruhel Islam 28:45 Yes, when I started a restaurant I see like a lot of ingredients shortage I see food shortage happening because you know, food something if you deal with even know every day you can tell what's going on. This is a first year of then what I started doing in the area gorilla gardening. I found sport drugs it's it's in the city come sometime you know the squash vine they cut it out and then some neighbors see they then some neighbors so then we had somebody I start conversation and dialogue about growing food, you know, urban farming, yes, slowly started there. The first person I know then gave me a plot in the community garden. This my first plot nearby community garden and I started growing food but for one of the important thing I grow which is Bangla squash, so Bangla for the Bangla squash, they found home in Minneapolis they cared now not only our big a lot of other big kid, they're growing squash. And then we started this and also this this is like a first year garden then all our people like some another anchors to work in so heavy they growing food so excited about you know so we learn like elder three and intergenerational conversation intergenerational dialogue intergenerational working together because we working with other people we learn to listen to them with a good listener something as a young people's to move forward to make the change and but this kind of thing through gardening you know that green hold community with a word Gandhi Mahal gardening like a strength to surprise and I start growing cilantro and start growing green khichuri green tea then Bangla beans they never seen those kinds of things woody you know the shaag laal Bangla beans the babies those kinds of things then the loud shock slowly people everyone coming gathering what's going on here then I start having when winter comes very sad because I to wrap up a routine so hard in a farmer like he continuously you have to find ways to in back home go all around then close everything your garden Oh Michael is a closing party again. So like every three months opening closing you know like it's that's why a lot of in America in Minnesota a lot of people are discouraged to grow food because it's not easy. It's a sort of labor of love and it's a lot of work but what I did the way we started like I teamwork collaborating with different organization bring people together, it's not me and I started a important program called Food barter economy like a casual we have a cat dog food barter economy, which is partnering with University of Minnesota Aqua in class and other local schools good call Yeah. All local schools have they participate in this process and we encourage them. So, I feel because in I remember in 2012 when I was lucky enough to host a 19-23 people from Minnesota all around America from you know sustainability class Person village in Bangladesh in my village, in our closed food system. So I said you know, I want to do this program back here to table initiative and grow food security and up you know, I want to create a local food reserve bank. So, I share why I told them example, this this the the way, this student came together 2012 In June, we started and harvested 1800 pounds of vegetable from this garden. So which this is this is now called Gandhi Mahal interfaith garden. But we went to this that 60 by 20 You know, it's big for the city but not too big for us, we grew up in the village you know, that good -8- Transcribed by https://otter.ai enough then soil was a bad soil, not a good soil, like it has a lot of arsenic. So we doing we take all the soil out bring all the soil in, you know freshly then, which is weird to practice like a regenerative agriculture. You know, back home when you grow food. I saw in our farmer and you know, our family from then they leave some food for the soil, you know, then turned around. Maheen Zaman 33:47 This is in Longfellow composting, the 60 by 20 plot? This is in Longfellow neighborhood? Ruhel Islam 33:52 in Longfellow neighbor, Longfellow neighborhood in Minneapolis, South Minneapolis still had that it's gotten to a one to twenty secondary south that south Minneapolis and it was not too far from that restaurant, Gandhi Mahal, and I say to my wife, that was Gandhi Mahal, and garden was this site. Maheen Zaman 34:09 And this is before the aquaponic farming the you? Ruhel Islam 34:11 before that before the aquaponic then 2012 to 2014. In these two years, I grow food. And every year I begin to wrap up with the bolenta when I say food barter economy, you know, I'll finish up the garden story that 2013 We did 10 different gardens in the community we call it Bijar like a big care just gardening for urban agriculture by Justice and anyone they care to table initiative. So that's a closed food system so we work together with a lot of our volunteers, a lot of volunteers. it's not me. We are leading by example with when everyone support you. When everyone gives make their hands dirty in a big part of it. it can happen labor of love we cannot, that time is best if I had to pay 100 volunter I cannot do any further I'll be broke. But what did what I did, I also did a food barter economy so Tim garden, Jenny, individual farm manager from different school students, and I say wherever you grow keep the record. Our thing is like a micro finance style we invested money in the different 10 different plots, seedlings startup everything. Then say we had 10,000 pounds a vegetable we stockpile for our food reserve bank for security and average every student if I spent $200 For per plot the example I'm giving whatever money left after their food barter economy, I was giving them a check to because we are so happy end of the holiday they get a small check. These are you You make I don't only I mean not only volunteer because our young generation you have to encourage them in a different way. This is what you know I learned we bring up oh find funny grow then there's a celebration. So we did this and everyone's happy. So we've been growing local food 10,000 yearly local food in our community for our customer. And now during the pandemic time what's really we all experience which is sense a sense of belonging because food not coming in shortage and from my experience I changed my business model right away which is curry in a hurry right now but I started during the pandemic time because restaurant I said we know how to handle any pandemic because we grew up with a river of those as I mentioned before, so why did exactly Bangla belay style spiritual sanitation which is you know, in back home in the village I saw people get sick they quarantined people on the corner one room they put some kind of pitball fire pit or something so anyone go in and out make sure that go over the fire so any bacteria virus things they die you know you probably don't say Brother Javan barium Cinco village you know they did give a children newborn baby you cannot go without those things so I remember those thing I bought this cart they say I don't know people are taking hand sanitizer shortage this shortage that -9- Transcribed by https://otter.ai shortage I says no worries so I created those and ramaden the process 1-2-3 process okay, I was ready to start community again even the dining. I closed actually we closed restaurant before governor close because I thought this is the time let's enjoy it. I don't want any dine into coming in I raised so before they started shutdown officially I shut down for our area and I lead by example for community how to deal with it so we started 1-2-3 process you know 1-2-3 persons like at one place in order online. There's a lot of we had to struggle a lot but we survived. We did it and was doing really good. Then this George Floyd was murdered by the police and rescue we're gonna Maheen Zaman 38:26 ask the question later but can you go back to how the aquaponic farm started because I went down 2015 spring like are did gone 2014 rebuilding at the time I remember Ruhel Islam 38:41 2000 So that while I was sitting I said Well think about that. I I said like I started then wrapping up every year then I said how can we do? I started meeting with the people how can we do a closed food system I have a abundant basement, under the restaurant. I want to do indoor garden. Then you know gardening then also in when I says back home we have upon our pond is aquaponic system. But America we call it a aquaponic because I saw pond then we grow food by the pond. Beans squash everything, but we don't have to never give watering then I realize this is a whole nice system here indoor but we have a back home in our outdoor. So I showed this to the kids and we commissioned some local youth organization commissioned to do a feasibility study for us. We hired them. We spend a lot of money for this because sometimes it's good investment because this will become a very one of the first in closed food looped system in the entire country according to you know some newspaper a Star Tribune, like a aquaponic in the closed off food system and it's like a 200 step away from the kitchen. You know, where we're growing highest ingredients like cilantro sometime in the winter is what I was having cilantro all around Harry Potter so yeah the first time made in Minnesota Harry Potter. Then I started growing spinach. Spinach which is longevity spinach, spinach so good for your health and diabetics and sugar and other stuff. Then main thing is fish tilapia so here fish you know. Then I grew up with that fish gotta like you're hungry go with the boy row go catch a fish and bring it to your mom fresh right away there's like a best thing you can experience. And I I brought this experience to let our customer our friends and family to the basement. Sunday I said okay, I'm gonna go catch it Bangla style and whole process we did a few of them to educate people how to you know cook fish kick it fish the way then you know like a healthy fish it's where some of the stuff we educate about the turmeric I start growing turmeric in the basement didn't, it's a lot of work but I tried it's possible. But I could not continue because it's not enough. You need a lot of space. You say 2, 3, 4 show up, even I try to grow saffron. Saffron was popping up but never you know I never ever be able to harvest but they died before they flower. I tried that I told student don't worry. If you don't fail you're not going to learn. Failing is a good thing. You know, you failed and you know next time you can you can keep some directors educational, everything in education. Then 2014 finally commissioned people 15 project was done we did a huge thing celebration about that. And after that every year until our building burned down is to throw our 1000 store to the basement small spill excuse me we open up for young generation to all kind of school Primary School I mean kindergarten to college everyone's to come study on so we have a University of St Thomas A their social entrepreneurship class they are one of the syllabus from our about our project we did so we work with them and then they're they helped me figure out what actually - 10 - Transcribed by https://otter.ai what I'm doing what should I call it they says after study professor to Professor put together they said this is called fully fed community which was which is you're doing it here so it was a wonderful working together I didn't know what is that call so I learned by working with the students and Professor every day you learn something. Then prolific committee this is what we are doing you know COVID Community. Everyone that means you care about soil, environment, fish, yard, chicken, goat. All part of the aurora environment and then you know after that a lot of we have a all progressive city, all congressmen, Democrats, everyone getting interest, also everyone coming to visit my basement. Al Franken Tina asked me you know and they came this also help like it. Tina ask me visited when I was building building over there to her right after our visit I got my license quick, you know, next day they came okay. So that because there was a no code in the city about restaurant basement aquaponics. So I just got license from you know, these are new, we are part of the new chain Okay, so I get a pay a lot then I get only that license from DNR. DNR officer and then next project now whole city has this paper on it the writing the letter we want to work with you to part of this process are to do so other people can to and I say I don't want too much more crazy on this just keep it say this way we're able to do it quick to go through your process too much. But we know how to grow fish and basement environment. Sudden cold like a food core you harvest fish put it under the eyes go down to 40 degree under 40 degree temperature then you feel a you know this person we know this is nothing new. And especially then I we made it Turmeric. Turmeric easy, some kind of antibacterial, antiviral it's an aromatic you know, whatever I wanted, they call very beneficial to medicina they helps preserve and prevent that made before in back home. There was a no trees and cooler and nothing. So how they should preserve food with the turmeric. When it turmeric dry them remember those things? My grandma my grandma used to? Maheen Zaman 45:11 Yeah. And now they put the turmeric, hipsters on Instagrams on everything from ice creams to milk and turmeric, Chai and all this right shot Ruhel Islam 45:22 on my tablet. I can't believe like someone called me enough, my friend. Oh, can you bring it on my table for America when you come on? Seriously? Hydroponic story. Oh Emily 45:42 all right. Thanks so much for that. Um, have you ever worked with Minneapolis Community College on any of the hydroponics or the three legged frog? Have you heard of those clubs? The Minneapolis Community and Technical College they have a three legged frog sustainability club and an urban farming club. I'm wondering if you ever got to work with them at all? MCTC? Yeah. MCTC. Ruhel Islam 46:09 Yeah, I think I think I gave probably sounds a lot of I don't remember. Because I used to have every intern from different college in order to help me to put all that in. There's a lot of science behind it. No. Yeah, our experiences sometime. I mean, it's become scientific later in home, but it was hoping to figure out those things. I think I think I did probably, right. I don't remember. But a lot of my team member was sometimes to go to MCTC college, or some of the volunteer also. I'm sure. All right. - 11 - Transcribed by https://otter.ai Emily 46:48 I was just curious. Um, alright, the next question I have for you, I know you went over a little bit of it. Before the hydroponic story, the change from pre pandemic versus post pandemic, if you could just go over how that change started when the virus was coming out and then like when it finally hit here, and then like what things you had to change for your restaurant? And then obviously, you know, your Gandhi Mahal restaurant got burned down and how that affected you? That's kind of story. Ruhel Islam 47:26 Yeah, I think the pandemic time I already probably mentioned some of the stuff like how we handled in a pandemic time. So this is also I could say like our mother's teaching grandma teaching, you know, that there was a pandemic time we did this 1-2-3 process. We changed some of our system which is shut down for dining and only did takeout and delivery. Maheen Zaman 48:00 so many restaurants shut down in Twin Cities and around the country because they couldn't pay the rent. Do you rent your space? Or do you own the whole space cuz I remember Ghandi Mahal got two eating areas and then a hall and I think the Samali school was also your property and so did you buy land or? Ruhel Islam 48:19 It was a like a one? Yeah, I wish to should pay rent by the sister organization you know was to own that thing, but not too much where you're supporting in ourselves. So Gandhi Mahal the first you say the main dining area then the kebab room. That's the children playroom area where the children and the start aquaponics there. Next room was a community room was give it back to community to this anyone is to come and use free of charge. You know the food meeting is always been there next door was a Somali grocery then returning to annex office like a co working space where his Defense Organization again 350 big movement, I mean IPL and Sierra Leone foundation spies and few other like Miss Lonnie and then a few five different people is to use this space all about community. And then the pandemic time actually we get a lot of support people from our our community people buying I see some people coming in and they're buying food like three, four times more food. So when I did very good business there pandemic type from takeout delivery. Everyone coming and buying food not only for themselves, sometime sets up in a sense of belonging, before delivering food to their friends and relatives inside and also we partner it there it says anyone in our area should not stay hungry. You don't have money, no problem. I started doing this way sending food everywhere. But also those people aren't sending food they also supporting me next time they coming, oh, I'm going to buy this. So the whole what we generate kind of economy locally, grow food in the backyard that was our our works really helped during the pandemic for the food shortage even though oil and stuff but you know figure out in their head like a we are we know planned so our our support was getting from the farmers and backyard different backyards vegetables and the stockpile in the cooler like 10,000 pounds of vegetables we headed the stock the time when I had fish in the basement, a fish producing cilantro you know I don't have to go out shopping in The Cup or anywhere any other place just have you know, cilantro green chili inside. So we're doing pretty good and also government has a program that turn people pay loans that also helps small business they help us to helping in boosting is one of the I think good help. Then I tell other people we should do this way. And you know, again leading by example I said yes I did and - 12 - Transcribed by https://otter.ai this way that way. Then pandemic, by the time we are handling pandemic, then murder of George Floyd you know, created unrest in our area that was it around the corner, my daughter recorded some when he was arrested in we are very watching Oh thing things are going and it was traumatize that time. Because then also traumatized in a sense, because we kind of ran away from this problem like it came here in America from Bangladesh, where we see this familiar with this kind of situation, you know, America and Bangladesh different is America still have right to go out protest. You know, no matter what you can protect your right to protect. In Bangladesh, we don't have those rights to third world country, you know, they say your life will be endangered. So that was my you know, I say that to participate in and then I see this injustice happening for all I slowly changing like I never seen even you know, in back home, we slaughter cow and stuff, you know, we never feel like very the way they treated put it under that, you know, I in the TV, everyone watching very traumatizing I wouldn't want it normal, any human to enlive this way. But obviously, you know, we things happening in our area and I started I think the first day or second day. Second day, probably so bright everywhere, you know, and the PR guess people start shooting that and I was just traumatized for this beginning was very fun, like everyone coming you know, participating first day, cool. Second day, I see traumatized because of police action, you know, police start shooting. And what? and we are you know, we're lucky. And also nobody's protecting us. You know, we came for our here in America for justice. We came for our freedom of speech, freedom of you know, like ever everything, especially for security. And I start feeling like very unsecure because nobody is there protecting us. And and I learn about like a injustice happening with our native sisters and brothers, our black sisters and brothers. It's been beginning of the history of America. You know, we learned a school Columbus discovered America. Then then when I came to New York, I thought Native American culture in the museum now I'm living within culture. And I feel like this is my culture. This was so close to our concert celebration. I I'm going to like a nap and during that time I went to water celebrations and remember you can line three movement participate all the movement with the food that time and the writer in our own eyes, you know also I see people come together. I said when he said that belonging our native organization sisters and all that our our you know American sister they were sisters. They all in front of the restaurant and there was a magazine that protecting us someone poorly when minority owned business you know in the in the in the life. They are protecting us there and we open up the door because we continue by the medic team we opened up our an exhibition committee room put in a bed. We are close by tattooist places those kinds of very bored right away bring the whole medic team and start treating people with amazed and becoming a like I opened up. Maheen Zaman 55:20 the tear gas right? put the milk in the eyes. Ruhel Islam 55:22 tear gas yes yeah tear gas and stuff and people were crying and I said. Maheen Zaman 55:26 We saw this in Ishka in Bangladesh we saw this issue with all the missing intaka I see that all the time from our apartment building the army going around and trucks and shooting and people protesting and you see that again in America it's very strange - 13 - Transcribed by https://otter.ai Ruhel Islam 55:39 really strange it was it was strange to matters but you know we know I'm sure how to that's why I was hindered okay you know this new treatment some people very bad we send them with their Moulins you know, a lot of teamwork when I become a doctor first time I feel like when you know taking running running around and watching other people doing all this our community actually trained us to be deal with or represent any situation you know in the bedtime comes and you have to represent and lead by example not react. reaction ruin everything or you have to represent the way so that you know, very positive way you unite people and move forward and get the things done. And that was I was very lucky I know that I said no, that's first thing is open up the medic teams. Then what people need hungry food I made that Khichuri dalin but Khichuri I know this is what we did in our flat time. The Khichuri something is a Bangla soul foods a grit is like a Bangladeshi grits are to explain whether germa you know Maheen Zaman 56:46 I make it for my kids all the time. It's it's it's another variety rice and beans but it's lentil mostly dealt with the red lentil I put Hmong down sometimes and then rice they cook it together with you know cumin, coriander, ginger garlic paste some you know of course turmeric lots of turmeric and you can put in anything in it. You can make it soupy you can make it drier right its supporters would you get the proteins from the dal and you get the starch from the rice and fibers and you have all your you know wood vegetables in there cook it everything you need. Ruhel Islam 57:25 if you can give some time kitar cut that's like a wonderful bedtime like outside is a cool people you know like a little bit of wind coming so I decided to make a dal sometime some evening dal bowtsa meaning like it this is a major breakdown down but in the kitchen at dal is something and put it in load in the cart, out cart walking around with feeding everyone wherever you know hungry needy and food and that is wonderful. And then I see after everyone else who come in supporting me. Okay, you know people try to contribute you supporting your support. So this really sense of belongings you know, was there then, of course 29, 28 You know, in the morning, I learned that my restaurant is burned down their line like across the cloud get burned down then fire across fire, burned by crossfire and not burned by protester people I know because of you working together is the outside world can we see a lot of kids came from outside and they are just throwing stone and breaking windows and like if people everyone had a fun like they are inside the jail for a long time during the Coronavirus and they had opportunity to get out and stealing looting the liquor and these and that everything everyone is involved but this was not the protesters. This is like outside people come in parties. We watch them when I try to talk them they Yeah, you know oh come on. Come on, man. We are. So some people intentionally did this to divert and we understand the gravity third world country this kind of polling we know. They want to divert. People ask me question why what do you say? they says, you know, let my building burn just in must be served. Because, you know, we don't divert your movement different direction that was all planned in a divert movement? Probably I don't know. But we bill people over property, you know, it's very important. And when the time calm, which will work together no matter what community you know, these were really even even you know, I live in the community to visit in the community. Some of my family Oh, leave come back. Come back over the go over there, I'm not leaving. No. Yeah, you know how our Bangla Okay, oh, dangerous, dangerous. I'm sending you ticket come back. I said no. Oh no. And I was embarrassed that time because you know, I so proud of that we because I said Bangladesh - 14 - Transcribed by https://otter.ai is like a ground zero for climate change. And Minnesota Minneapolis is ground zero for movement protest you know major protests against any you know darkness come anywhere with to stand up for other people right you know this is what Minnesota about so proudly, then now they say oh, why you talk our police here police killing people and all this different Bangladesh police is like you did go personally here present on you know, have a I mean, or anyone, nobody control them. They have their own control. But as I say you go against opposition party. So don't compare it. They're still protesting out. Nobody put me in that jail. We still speaking out for justice. This is the real democracy here. You get it? Oh, this never happened in Bangladesh. Oh, yeah. I mean, Maheen Zaman 1:00:59 to give Emily a context Bangladesh developed in the early 2000s, the special police force called Rapid Action Battalion RAP, it was under the theme BNP, but then on the other party is become like a personal militia, to shut down any opposition. It was initially done because a lot of crime has risen in Dhaka, and to deal with, you know, drug cartels to other kind of crime. And now they've become, you know, a way to silence opposition and silence. The opposition party for disclosure for the archive, my father's family from Bogra. So they have natural, tight or BMPs. I just want to reveal that nobody accuses me of being on bias, but so a lot of Bangladeshi's were complaining to us to like, Oh, look at your country is this and this and that is it. That's true. But again, despite all of that, there's still possibilities to democracy that we don't have anymore in Bangladesh. Ruhel Islam 1:01:56 Yeah, that's why I say like, I wake up, I'm blessed. I says, you know, Alhamdulillah, like, thanks to God, you know, here, how can you make another day a better day? And Maheen Zaman 1:02:06 like you said, it's possible because people like Martin Luther King, Jr, Malcolm X, Native American community, Latinx community, and you know others who have pushed the country to be better. Yes. Ruhel Islam 1:02:19 I think that I agree with from the like, you know, everyday learning, like, the civil rights movement actually give us more right then our black brothers and native brothers, sisters, you know, more demographic come people, sometimes tedious, like a work, you are a computer engineer or a doctor. You know, there's a lot of, even though you know, there is a difference here, whereas, when, if anyone, any black people cross the light or red light, the thing is a gang member or whatever it is, you know, these are, this is mindset, this problem inside Maheen Zaman 1:02:54 because model minority people from Asia like us, we're model minority, even though we have had wars and crimes and violence, as much as any part of the world. But racism that's as you know, your model minority you come here, and you're against black native and Latin X community, and then we will get the loans the positions, but not the best ones, but but better than others. So this is divide and conquer. We know this from South Asia, or the British to divide and conquer with the Muslims, Hindus, and how here some people in power do the same thing. Different ethnic groups. So once it's burnt down, you hear iit is burnt down and you're famous quote, was all over the news. I went to visit. And I was really - 15 - Transcribed by https://otter.ai sad because the first restaurant I went to eat was Gandhi Mahal. Like, Oh, this is a Bangladeshi restaurant. And then you see the ground, both the club and all the buildings like just all the way to the basement. And for me, it also reminded me of the World Trade Centers when it burned down. We built these things with steel so strong, but then fire is so destructive, right? And you think about Day of Judgment, like the Quran doesn't want the Ramadan awesome or not the fire, it will burn everything down. To go with arrogance and hatred. It's like a fire, it will burn everything down. So I saw that reflecting on that day remembering the the destructiveness of anger, hatred, fire, and also the punishment that awaits those who don't repent. So, I'm glad to hear like how did you then recover? I know you started Curry in a Hurry, which is a famous restaurant in New York and in London. We have the name was also but how did you plan to do it? How did you make that shift? Ruhel Islam 1:04:38 Yeah, you know that during the pandemic time, you know, again, no, like will ever go through like this. We are like a, God was preparing us to have Curry in a Hurry over there where they are like, it is all started for the pandemic, because of pandemic I start Curry in a Hurry idea was Hurry, hurry, can you come here? Like that whole idea was there pandemic it come, don't stay quick go. Slowly, slowly cooked. Food quickly sub slowly cooked, quickly served studying the whole idea. That's why people are coming and going. Same. It's like I said, it's kind of set in their mind. They come nobody, because a pandemic Come 1, 2, 3 go Curry in a Hurry. That was the whole idea. Maheen Zaman 1:05:25 Once the kitchen is burnt on, how did you find another kitchen then? Ruhel Islam 1:05:29 this is a community came together and gave us founders this kitchen actually, this is a wonderful. One of the brother is from, I think, somewhere in Africa and he's his wife own and his wife. He was like our chicken tikka masala in our food. And we was looking and they were going to build your home there, break this place in the corner and turn their own home. Then it says if you rent it, you're gonna hold it for how many years you need, say four years rent until we will then he says okay, for four years, they gave it rent to us. A very good price, good deal, you know, and this kitchen actually built by our community, all all the family come together, clean these and build it for us. And they say, you know, and I kept carrying her, you know, it's too much stuff going on and I don't know, you know, sometime, this is a like a. Sometimes, I feel like in next two, three years, you know, I was we are hoping to put together a feasibility study that $50 million project. So that's really like a living building first time regenerative living building in Minneapolis replanning. I don't know how far we can go and collaboration is Pina Walls theater you know try to collaborate and do it but now looks like no matter how much covered I do you know investment and return of investment 50 million in I have to work all my life then I'll become different kinds of slave to the system then resists study like this people saying in government if we need bond money like our consultants that study the pillar of our study finishes every study saying you have to the suggestion site to give my right to city give me I should not product realization so I am the only one was POC on land around this area one of the person now I have to give my land to under nonprofit you know, what are to structure this project? Maheen Zaman 1:07:43 - 16 - Transcribed by https://otter.ai The idea is your land you will own the land. Ruhel Islam 1:07:46 Yeah, yeah, we will not we started with the renting you know, actually I bought the restaurant $1 $1 $1 Then I turned it to a million dollar restaurant. The $1 I bought I get into the real like this is also I learned the system if you bring a new like a new restaurant a lot of process from the government licensing stuff then they'll say why don't you do it we'll do we'll do a little transition here. You pay $1 I paid cash one dollar and he signed by let's rent from the other tenant then he extend that transfer the reason I had to buy for $1 That was a good story because $1 is 10 bigger to million dollars or is $1 more is to make difference in the whole world now we're planning to bring all together but when I did rented you know I was right away in I thinking about like I'm paying rent every month and all given to someone that can just gonna start saving money talking to in 2014 Actually, finally, when I did aquaponic because then got permission the guy to this why this thinking the title and the 10 billion for clothes and then become owner of the building again they took it when I talked to bank because tenant has arrived and I have some good you know, I get involved and actually convinced them I called bank owner of the bank not I don't want to talk to me I want the owner because I learned from my uncle you know, you have to just got to the top then progress process for you. You can Maheen Zaman 1:09:36 say for a man. Yeah. To do several money was one of the longest serving finance minister Obama this. Ruhel Islam 1:09:46 Just yeah, that was my uncle. I know I grew up under his tutelage that's what I understand. He couldn't hold Bangladeshi bottomless basket. To he make it this an old country enjoying this economy. Make he called akhira Bangladesh economy he did the way system VAT other stuff countries to run it so nobody can you know no matter how bad people Coronavirus bothers GDP is high everything doing good because of the right policy and I see closely you know him he did agriculture way prior to agriculture, Agriculture Food Security farming fishery, I was part of so many of this wall USA program I seen it then he also says investing on farmer is never don't say it's a loss. This is a good investment they're producing food is adding to our food security. So don't think is a lot is adding. So if you invested in pharma is invested in human food for education program fourscore scholarship program. So I seen these and some of the things are implementing here actually, this helping me those experience, you know, entering my gardening and growing food, bring the book together, those experience really helped me. Emily 1:11:05 So after all of your experience from 2005, to coming here and seeing them pandemic, do you think the state in the community is moving in the right direction? Do you think the country's making progress? How would you say like the community is changing? Is it moving forward? Based on your observations and experiences? Ruhel Islam 1:11:27 Yes, you know, I'm every day you know, we learning something new, you know, something's tough, but - 17 - Transcribed by https://otter.ai Maheen Zaman 1:11:37 do you feel optimistic? You feel Ruhel Islam 1:11:39 no mercy yet? Justice? I talk about the justice system, you know, even though we have a freedom of speech, freedom of right. And but But here, you know, it's not, you have to prove to get justice, you know, thing. And my experience sometime some people have privilege, they automatic. People assume like, Oh, these are the good people. Okay, oh, people have no idea. These are the Muslim people, they treat their human where, you know, people that they marry four times, then people sometimes like a sound by Judge oh, maybe these that these are the, you know, a little bit of racial justice problem. I seen every now, before I was so busy, like a building community, I didn't pay attention. I learned like a positive move forward, move forward, still moving forward, then went on to be paying attention. I see Oh, my God, what an injustice can happen. Especially, especially, you know, the immigrant community actually Bangla community, male community, my example. We, I was on a restaurant actually work with Volunteers of America, which is a halfway house, you know, people go to jail after a certain time for reentry to the community. So I work with them in the reentry force help people get into the community. So I face a lot of them. I like a lot of white people will be traumatized. They grew up in bed experiment, so many I learned, I try to have to help them, give their privacy supervised, and bring them back to the community. So rather, people get back in their community than normal. They're not people not but people some time for small thing. This other opposition or person or other party have a lot of proof. Oh, this is enough. But actually, this was not a real justice. I'm saying I'm trying to say and especially a lot of immigrant people getting justice by this process, okay, under white people are different culture, Western culture people is not going to get real justice. Because if even if, like a bit between I'm supposed to round people, if someone a judge, maybe they have some family problem, like I said family issues, family issues, then also they work together, right, they began to work issues. So actually, it is a familiar problem. But they work together in the same place, you know, saying so slowly. You know, some people will look at Oh, this is in a workplace but some people familiar on people within our this is this. So those time, people very difficult to understand the justice to people what is really happening, you know, people don't understand. Maybe we need to like where we are doing a lot of educational stuff like if that don't you know you do your thing we do our thing fasting we educating people same way we need to educate our justice system like this country married people of color immigrants and other people. But originally I did believe like a written by the people to benefit their own people that was you know when they did all this stuff so that's why I believe systematic change real change to be happen based on my experience and otherwise if you can be someone very you know that people all behind you without understanding anything sometimes you don't understand a lot of things but we call one of the Justice problem is like we pay attention to chili a cow can eat Chili Chili, can you guess? Why does everyone agree? What is that? Like if Maheen Zaman 1:16:06 it was gonna be like, if a dog bites you? Do you bite the dog back? Right? Like that's the nature of the dog you don't behave the same way as them is because it does that too. Ruhel Islam 1:16:16 - 18 - Transcribed by https://otter.ai Yeah, one of the one of the Hassan Avi writing writer he wrote this about like his ego, tried to take a nap, yes, is here and then this guy going after Eagle why people asking him why deny their night, oh, the eagle took my ear, you know, run run run then later someone says oh, just quite a new sees the the O is here. But Whole day whole night he ran off there you go because you got so these are the stuff here going on, you know sometimes. And then also in social media world, good thing and bad thing, you know, sometimes really good staff can become bad investor become good, they change. I'm like sometimes nervous about those things. And I'm embarrassed sometimes about what happening here in America, you know, police to other people, and also also like a I see some kind of anti Muslim policy some kind of even though we have a more freedom here, you know, what something is there, which is like it any war going against very example, if you open your eyes, if you say anywhere or going against a Muslim or Muslim against anything is become a different category, when you know when like suppose Russia and what is called that? A crane, right? Nobody calling no one terrorist, there are bad people. When these are like we need to understand speak out about this is very important to for the change our young generation, how through intergenerational conversation or to learn from our elder, how do you experience this, then these kids, they can make a difference if you only if you tell have a conversation, not from the history, history written by the winner, he never get a real history from a book only got booked can be a real story, you know. But there is a real story is written by because there is a whoever when they change it back in Bangladesh, everything checking was even though Mawlana bhashani. We had our very leader who really that their name is disappear. They're familiar is a begging, begging that a very becoming bigger, and I can only take care of them. But people are calling themselves something, something something, you know, this thing everywhere. Maheen Zaman 1:19:04 The contact monitor person he was a Muslim wrestler, but also socialist and advocate of the farmers and workers both. And he created the the People's Party only. And this didn't win in the 60s. Then he became you know, it was taken over by somebody else. But and he's from this area of silicon, Assam and did all this work there to give all the Black Panther Party all the power to all the people. And he believed in that. And then a family took over that party who then claimed to be the founding father and all these different things. So that's a contentious thing bothers you politics. But I'm so happy to hear that, you know, you advocate for sharing storytelling between different generations. And you have children. Your daughter became famous because she quoted you in the newspaper. And they weren't abolish, like I've grown up there. You've grown up there but my kids too. They are American Muslim. Bangladeshi descent how do they identify in you as well as the three identities Bangladeshi, Muslim, and American, whereas biology means being Muslim, but here they have to separate the two. How do you see the you know, with American history to Native Americans, but the first Muslims are black Muslims and slaved Muslims. And then we have other Muslims right and the weekend was immigrants. How do those identities Connect? Being Muslim being American being moms for you? And for the next generation like in your children, what do you envision what do you think will happen for your family in the future in Minnesota? Because we have a huge Muslim community now me coming on to Somali refugees has changed everything for the city Ruhel Islam 1:20:44 yes actually Somali refugees contributed to Muslim community in America a lot winning culture make it very normal in in you know what I'm what I'm working interfaith relations intergenerational relation I'm - 19 - Transcribed by https://otter.ai hoping to make change I want to like a see my daughter can tell you know my we are Bangladeshi origin proudly but how is a home teaching telling participating the stuff I'm doing leading by example for not only my family a lot of family a lot of community actually in all around the world now in London in I when I went to London I see New York everywhere and also like when I was growing up one more tear I also watch our color is a problem we have a racism problem in third world country like Bonacci colorism programs we have a we had caste system which is you know right after Islam came to Bangladesh to cover from you know caste system is disappear still poor people maintained within but there was like a equality to you know this thing with Islamic culture body quality over there and in America I feel you know a lot of stuff I supposed to be supposed to do as a Muslim and as a rapper from Orlando my mom and I grew up in the Muslim community in the family I feel everything is here like America festival the charity is very remote month of Ramadan and they do if you give charity days like official he actually did some part of the debit vector community and you get benefits and stuff and charity you're supposed to do a lot as a Muslim anyway go you know this is your this is I feel here a different angle then I try to tell my kids look we did this but here also officially then somehow they all equal in like you can call even though before I thought you know 100 years later I will get justice but justice something you have to advocate for it then you can get just you have to work hard to get just it's not easy. It cannot take for granted you have to fight for it. immigrant community Bangla community like a normal our generation we normally have before our elder who came they were not ignoring but they don't have to be bothered like oh no, forget it. I'm not gonna involve in our generation like me personally, I get involved with community building community, because our children grow up here they have to list their country and also they cannot be culturally lost. But to be a good citizen, good human being. You have to have your roots you have to know where the roots come from. The way we have to know whether food come from there's a whole society we did it. We have to know root confirm, you know, any she's become unbusinesslike if you cool I know. Emily, maybe you cook in a few of our spice something they do too much salt. What will happen? unbalancing if you were too much chili powder, too much turmeric is healthy, but if you put too much, it's become unbalanced. So what is going on in the world? Here? We we we advocate without we do as America promote democracy all around the world. You know, but also i Everyday I try to land what is going on because this is also creating revenue for America as the America immigrant. When you start dreaming about America to come America, you will Start paying money, spending money on America the day one, pay a fee for these a day, a lot of stuff involved. Some people land some people sell their land to come to America. You know, these are expensive or maybe you cannot afford to do all this thing you know, come to America then I tell my kids you are because I was born here going to school, all the access, you will complete our country, all the facility as a you know, like a wonderful retirement benefit with a ba ba This is all part of our culture, our culture teachers to do this, but this is officially doing it you know, so that's why I feel I found my own little thing you can do it right. You can practice it. Only if you want, you can use it, how you want to live your life. And don't forget who you are, we can get there. These were I telling my kids and I can take them to mostly when I pass the library movement the parents are telling Winona LaDuke in the policy, I participate all these things because I they said that celebration when they when they do what it called the poaching wild rice poaching and stuff in our waters our best. The River of our bequest exactly same then after harvest, they celebrate happy celebration. We have this culture in Bangladesh we season six season celebration they also celebrate six Season Four Season Arbaaz fall these they're you know fishing everything we do also fishing celebration they do in celebration, you know, and another important thing when I connect we are all related we are connected with with food, water, whether she's - 20 - Transcribed by https://otter.ai getting fish, everything, but in Minnesota, you know we have ice fishing the first time when I went to go ice fishing I was surprised and shocked making the old getting cast a fish and this is like a different feelings you don't want to use if you're a first time you can have that feeling. And if you're a fish guy from Minnesota fish guy, you can feel those feelings get very sub surprised because we survived and I learned about PCs under the water water is you know, I went with a DNR. I really like it. Then when i i Could I was so lucky I get a big fish right away, you know, look at the tap, tap tap that big northern pike and I was photoshooting you know, and photoshooting and I'm planning Oh, I'm gonna go I have a cylinder in the winter in my basement. I have a pitch region in my basement. I have a this pin as I'm making manos. Then gender officer says no, you have to put it away is a big fish who say no, it's more than 22 inches so there is a protection for the fish to in America. Security disagree. Oh man, I don't care. No, no, no, you get fine. So I run and also like you eat fish because fish is available because they're protecting the fish. This what I'm saying our culture and the Islamic culture the Muslim supposed to protect the fish, but like the enemy or not eat all of them keep for a generation with chicken or lamb and everything. So these are the you know, experiences I feel so good about. I'll take all my kids with me to run fishing for my kids, I'll know now how to cook is a survival thing to learn. And it's a problem there. Remember, food brings people together you are hungry, you angry, you eat good food. Everybody medicina food is a medicine they will calm you down then you have a conversation and dialogue then you can make the world better plays and you can have it can be the change and you can even make a difference when you were covering so you need to eat good food. If you need to have a good food you have to know the food come from that means you have to grow your own food Emily 1:29:31 I think this might be my last question to ask. So if there's one thing you could say to the world what would it be? Just like a final message Ruhel Islam 1:29:44 lot of thing coming i don't know i One of the things recently I'm facing like a people a lot of people become greedy so be fair to each other. I'm trying to say this Be fair that's when they are going to be get healing. If you're not fair you're going to be get your own feelings. So be fair, you know to each other right ways to be treated. And I again say like you know, also reminding people that karma you do bad things come back to you. Even though my business burned down. It's a material victory the brick, right? We can rebuild again. But also have time, then good. 10 comes. So don't be stressed out about heartache, try to learn how to move forward and don't move forward and learn from those things and you know, do it better. last two years. If I just cry cry or my original burn down, no, then I'll be still set. Next day I woke up by say I'm alive, building gone. But the community we build it is there. And we are those work those building community now in a sense of belonging is there because of that. So be fair to each other. I'll say again, - 21 - Transcribed by https://otter.ai
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Title: Transcript of Oral History with Vernon Jensen, 2019
Collection: Augsburg Centennial Oral Histories
Search Result: Transcript of Oral History with Vernon Jensen RG 21.4.2019.11.08 JensenVernon 0:01 This is Vernon Jensen. The date is November 8, 2019. 0:10 September 1941 began a whole new life for me. I was entering into the world of higher education. My uncle, Martin Bloomquist, had loaned me $200 To en...
Show more Transcript of Oral History with Vernon Jensen RG 21.4.2019.11.08 JensenVernon 0:01 This is Vernon Jensen. The date is November 8, 2019. 0:10 September 1941 began a whole new life for me. I was entering into the world of higher education. My uncle, Martin Bloomquist, had loaned me $200 To enable my enrollment at Augsburg College in Minneapolis, where the tuition was only $90 per year. I had saved some money for my CCC days--that's the Civilian Conservation Corps--days, and my summer employment in the Lindstrom bakery ice cream shop. Martin never let me paid back the $200, so it was a gift. Not a loan. I have always been grateful that he was willing to help me get started. 1:00 My close friend Dick Frost, and I became roommates on the second floor of Augsburg's men's dormitory, Memorial Hall. He had a part-time job at his uncle's grocery store on 27th and Lake Street, which was a short streetcar ride from Augsburg. Through Augsburg's Student Employment Bureau, I secured a job washing dishes in a small mom-and-pop restaurant in downtown Minneapolis, a block away from the armory and across the street from Bemis Bag Company, whose workers made up most of our noon lunch customers. I had to purchase a bike to get to work at noon, and back quickly to class, and then back to work for the evening meal. Bikes, not cars were common on the campus scene. I received free meals, which included a bag lunch prepared by the restaurant owners, for my dorm room breakfast, which was kept outside my dorm room window for refrigeration. 2:14 Classes and on the semester schedule included German human anatomy, English, Bible and Physical Education. I found that I could handle them okay, with a sort of a B+/ A-minus average, which gave me the confidence I needed. Extracurricular opportunities at this small college enabled me to continue my high school interests and expand into new ventures. I continued playing my trumpet in the band, and sang in the Choral Club, which is a second-level group compared to the college choir. I played on the freshman basketball team, which practiced in the Minneapolis Armory, making it handy for my dishwashing duties a block away. I joined the Writer's Club and the International Relations Club. I was a member of the debate team, and it was very meaningful to go to debate tournaments, for example, by train to Concordia College in Moorhead, or to an important local one at St. Thomas and St. Paul. 3:30 It was an awfully good feeling to be with upperclassmen in such an activity. I participated in the college oratory contest in the spring and constructed the speech, "One World Indivisible," which stressed my internationalist views as against those isolationist views, which were fairly strong in some quarters. These and other activities enabled me to make a number of friends and expand my interests. Some weekends in the fall were spent hitchhiking to Lindstrom, to work in the bakery. Rides were fairly easy to count on, for hitchhiking in those days was somewhat common. I remember studying my German flashcards, a German [word] on a small card, with the English word on the reverse side, as I waited for a ride, so as to make the best use of time. 4:36 Daily chapel at Augsburg was compulsory, with men and women segregated. Toward the end of my first year, our speech class had an assignment to construct some speech working toward improvement of campus life. And I remember holding forth that men and women should not be segregated. A girl in the class agreed with me, so we went in to see President Christensen with our suggestion. He listened courteously and implemented such a change shortly thereafter. I think he was surprised by these naive and brash freshmen, however, and he suggested that if we had any other ideas for campus reform, we should take them to the student council first. While I didn't appreciate very much the conservative and dogmatic preaching in chapel, it was a learning experience to formulate my own religious positions by confronting these contrary views and emphases. 5:44 Pearl Harbor, December 7, 1941, meant that college dreams may have to be set aside or even forgotten. Along with other college students, I joined the Army Reserves, which permitted us to remain in school until called up for active service. In March 1943, shortly after the beginning of the second semester, I was called to active service and inducted at Fort Snelling, along with many other college students from around the state. I ended up serving in an engineer regiment in Europe, and was discharged from the Army in January 1945. I arrived back home via the train, and the old branch line from Wyoming to Lindstrom had lanterns swaying from the ceilings. It was, of course, an emotional reunion with mother. After those uncertain years, I had written to her weekly, usually Sunday evenings, throughout my army life. 6:58 Well, I immediately explored returning to college and thought it would be more practical to wait for the spring term at the University of Minnesota, rather than rush into the second semester at Augsburg, which began the first week of February. However, attending an Augsburg basketball game at the armory, and meeting familiar faculty and students, nudged me into returning to Augsburg. And I'm glad I did, for I was able to move right into studies and activities, which were very meaningful and rewarding. My courses at the University of Kentucky and Shrivenham in England during the war, transferred with no problems, so I could plan to graduate in three semesters. 7:47 In the spring, I was elected student body president for 1946-47, and this opened up many leadership opportunities. I attended the founding of the National Student Association at the University of Chicago. I'd seen some of the organizers at the conference in London the previous fall, and in the following year organized a gathering at Augsburg of student body presidents of the Minnesota State and Private Colleges, supporting various projects on behalf of students, like the Student Union facilities in the basement of the newly-constructed Augsburg Science Building, and furthering the interests of students in various situations was a challenging and interesting responsibility. 8:37 As Student Body President, I was contacted by the rector of the state young Republican Party to start a group at Augsburg. While I was hardly a Republican, I was strongly interested in one of their main endeavors at the time, which was to nominate for the U.S. Senate someone to unseat the Republican Senator Henry Shipstead, who, along with Senator Langer in North Dakota, were the only two votes against having the U.S. join the United Nations, which of course, [was] strongly advocated by Harold Stassen and other more liberal Minnesota Republicans. In fact, at a small gathering of about 12 student leaders, I was invited to have lunch with Stassen at St. Olaf. I felt strongly the need for an international outlook. And while overseas, I was embarrassed to have to say to my fellow GIs that Shipstead was indeed from my home state. 9:40 I hasten to add that when I became a young instructor at Augsburg a few years later, I was instrumental in organizing a Democratic Club to balance my former error. I might as well confess at this point, that I've been a lifelong Democrat, though I obviously crossed party lines in a number of instances. I lived in a room in the real Old Main building before it came down. But in my senior year, I roomed on the third floor of Memorial Hall with [Victor] Vic Emerson, [Seymour] Sy Nelson and [Arthur] Art Rholl. double-bunks were now the standard, for the flood of returning students exceeded available dorm facilities. 10:26 Part-time employment was at Fairview hospital, where I mopped floors, cleaned windows, changed drapes, ran the elevator--which were operated by humans in those days--and did other housekeeping chores. I also waited on tables in the Augsburg dining hall, which was then in the basement of Memorial Hall, and which served men and women who came over from the girls' Siversten Hall dorm by Fairview, and in semi-formal atmosphere, with white tablecloth, and we waiters in white jackets. These were pleasant jobs, and the proximity to the Campus saved much time. 11:11 I continued my prewar interest in participating on the Debate Team, and in the International Relations Club. I became a member of the tennis team, and we tied St. Thomas for the state championship in my senior year. We practiced and played home matches at Riverside Park. My major was history, and my minor was speech,--no major yet available in speech. And I enjoyed those subjects and other courses very much. I even took piano for a semester, in part because I realized how appreciated were those GIs, who could play the piano in the recreation halls of army camps. I took education courses to qualify to teach in Minnesota high schools, and did two weeks of practice teaching in Milaca, Minnesota. My friend from Lindstrom days, Clayton Oberg, was pastor of the Methodist church there, and he and his wife, Mary, invited me to live with them. 12:16 My student government and part-time work probably did cause my grades to suffer a little, but I was happy to graduate Cum Laude. I feel that I definitely got a strong academic grounding for graduate studies. Our Commencement program was held in Trinity Lutheran Church, a couple of blocks from the college, which was the site for all large college functions. The church building was later demolished when the freeway was built. I was chosen to be class speaker, which was a meaningful experience. The excellent commencement address was given by Governor Luther Youngdahl. 13:01 I received my M.A. at the University in June, 1948, and in the meantime, President Bernard Christansen at Augsburg asked me if I would be interested in teaching European history and speech at Augsburg 1948-49. I was honored to have the opportunity. I had three sections of European civilization, and my speech obligations included coaching the debate team and administering the annual oratory contest. It was a lot of work, but I thoroughly enjoyed it. And again, it gave me confidence that I could actually teach at the college level.
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Title: Transcript of Oral History with Nasmath Amegankpoe, 2022
Collection: Muslims in Minnesota Oral History Project
Search Result: Transcript Barbara Sabino Pina 0:01 Um, so All right, so I'll start by saying that the day Today's Wednesday. Oh no, no, no Wednesday, Thursday, April 13, 2022. This is Barbara Sabino Pina for Muslims in Minnesota Oral History Project. I am here with Nasmath. Thank you so much for agreeing ...
Show more Transcript Barbara Sabino Pina 0:01 Um, so All right, so I'll start by saying that the day Today's Wednesday. Oh no, no, no Wednesday, Thursday, April 13, 2022. This is Barbara Sabino Pina for Muslims in Minnesota Oral History Project. I am here with Nasmath. Thank you so much for agreeing to participate in this oral history project. I want to remind you that this may be published as part of the Oral History Archives project at Augsburg University. And I need your permission to record this conversation. So, do you agree to be, for this conversation to be recorded? Nasmath Aldrin 0:46 Yes. Barbara Sabino Pina 0:47 Okay. So why don't you introduce yourself and just say, when and where were you born? And whatever else you want to share about yourself? Nasmath Aldrin 0:55 Okay, thank you, Barbara, for the opportunity to be here and share with you. My name is Nasmath Amegankpoe, originally from Republic of Benin in West Africa. Born and raised in Benin, as a Muslim. Since 2001, where I migrated here to US following my husband. So, currently live in Minnesota, and that where I've lived since 2001 with two kids, two young adults (laughs). Yes, and I'm a registered nurse by background. Barbara Sabino Pina 1:37 Um, why don't we talk a little bit about since you mentioned your family, um, why don't you introduce a little bit about your family? Like, maybe your parents? You have any partner, or your children? Nasmath Aldrin 1:54 Yes, absolutely. I was born in Benin. And my mom actually is the elementary school teacher. My dad was an accountant. He's passed away now since 95. And so I just grew up in, you know, in a Muslim family, Muslim environment, Muslim culture. And married actually, right as I was moving to US, and so been living here since 2001 with my husband and my two kids. Barbara Sabino Pina 2:30 Beautiful. Um, so you mentioned that you were born in Benin, or the Republic of Benin, long time ago. I was wondering if you could share a little bit about your childhood, like, where do you... like the neighborhood, you lived in? How did the people look like around you? What type of culture do you experience growing up? And things like that? Nasmath Aldrin 2:57 Absolutely. Growing up was a lot of fun, really different from US, I have to say. Just in the fact that we went to school, of course, it's a topical country. We went to school in the morning from eight to twelve. And then we came back home, we walk pretty much all the distances, didn't have to ride a car. Well, you know how to take that bus. My dad does have a chauffeur-driven car, but some-sometimes when he's, you know, he wants to, you know, just wanted to play this a little bit, they will drive us to school, but otherwise, it was walking everywhere. And which, which was a good thing, really. And, you know, the places also was very nice around the house, you know, family were over, pretty much every day, the weekend. There was always something in the neighborhood, we were just, you know, it was a, the neighborhood itself was a big, I will say big family, you know, big family member or we could be in anybodies house, you know, and without any worries. And any, anybody in the neighborhood or, you know, parent, we're considered our parent. So you get in trouble anyway (laughs). It follows you (laughs), you can't really (laughs), you can't really get away with anything, but, you know, it was a lot of fun, you know, play and of course, we had to be at home for our daily prayers, you know, so, the school schedule was perfect, and at the same time, you know, on weekends, we, we went to our Islamic school to learn about our faith. And, and so, you know, mainly. But very fun, a lot of fun. A lot of activities just between each other. Yeah. Barbara Sabino Pina 5:05 Awesome. That sounds like a lot of fun. Um, I'm wondering, so you were mentioned, you mentioned a little bit about your neighborhood and a little bit about, like, how you will gather with your family all together. Um, so I'm wondering since you said that you move you now move into United States, but you were born in Benin. Why did you come to America? Or how did that process go? Was it your parents who brought you here? Was it you came here for yourself? A little bit of the process of the immigration process? Nasmath Aldrin 5:42 Yeah. Actually, in college, in my first year in college is when I met my husband, my, you know, current husband. And so we met and I came here actually following him. I was still finishing my school, when he moved to US. So about two years before me, he moved to us, following the it's called "diversity visa". And so he came in, it was just a natural thing to follow Him. When I was done with my bachelor. Barbara Sabino Pina 6:21 Awesome, do you know, did your husband ever told you like, why the United States? Was it like an opportunity he had here? Or? Like, basically, why specifically, the United States out of all the countries? Nasmath Aldrin 6:40 Yeah, good. Actually, it was a time where Bill Clinton, you know, was the President of the United States. And he started a program called "diversity visa". So basically, they extend to different countries around the world. Certain amount of visa is also called "lottery visa". And that anyone who, you know, played that year, you know, there was a certain amount that was allocated, and my husband happened to play that year. And he was a chemical engineer, he graduated and was just had just started working. And somebody talked to him about the lottery visa. And so he really liked it, because he had always wanted to go abroad, you know, and he wanted better things for the family. He wanted to go abroad. And so when that opportunity came, he played, you know, this lottery visa, and he won, you know, he was one of those people that were picked for that year to get that visa. And so that's how he came here. And of course, naturally, when I... I wanted to stay back and finish my degree. And so I followed him as soon as I was done. Barbara Sabino Pina 8:05 Awesome. And go, how was that process? If you don't mind me asking, what...after he came here was he the one who requested you to come? and How long did all that process take? Nasmath Aldrin 8:20 Yeah, it was um... Yes, he requested me to come. Of course, he has sent like an invite to, you know, for me to come and how long it take, I think he will know better (laughs). I think he started, I want to say he started the process right before I graduated the year, right before I graduated in the same year, that was in 2... in 1999. In 1999, and so it probably took about I'm gonna say about maybe about a couple of months to a year. And so and so he invited me and then I, you know, I came in, I came and joined him, you know, for the first few um... I want to say for the first two years, clearly, I want to stay home, stay at home mom, I did not work. And, you know, in those same years, you know, I had about three to four years, I had my two kids and so I stayed home to raise them till they were a year and a half and just about a year. And after that is when I actually we actually decided for me to walk outside of the house. And in then, you know, that's how my career, you know, my working career started in us and I worked initially as a nursing assistant that I was, you know, trying to get my degree converted here and that took some classes, and then I was able to, to go for my life, hence the registered nurse here in US. Barbara Sabino Pina 10:09 So where did you go and leave when you arrived, in the United States? Nasmath Aldrin 10:14 I came straight to Minnesota. He was in Minnesota, yes, he was living in Minnesota at the time, we lived in Roseville. And, you know, at the end of 2001, after our daughter was born, we moved into a two-bedroom apartment in North temple. And, you know, about two years after that, close to me having my second child is when we moved to a house that my husband purchased at the time in White bear. And that's where, you know, both kids go went to elementary school, middle school, and it's in their high school that we actually moved to Maple Grove. And currently, we live in Brooklyn Park, and they are both in college. Barbara Sabino Pina 11:14 And that's awesome. That is really awesome to hear. Why Minnesota? Do you know why your husband came specifically to Minnesota? And why you both stayed so long? Nasmath Aldrin 11:26 (Laughs) Barbara Sabino Pina 11:26 And not moving to any other state? Nasmath Aldrin 11:29 That's a good question. He actually came, he came in stayed with a friend in Alexandria, Virginia. And, you know, after he stayed there for a few months, he really wanted to be able to, you know, to continue his education. And he also saw that the job, there was a big... the job markets there. He was working in a in restaurants, you know, just the little job, you know, to, to be able to survive. And he realized that it was kind of competitive, but not was not, you know, was not, I will say what, was not really the job that he wanted to do, really, he really wanted to pursue his education. And so and it was not paying that well, either. So at some point, he decided he needed to separate and get his own place. And somebody actually, at the time, told him that Minnesota was a good place to get a good job and to get a better paying job, and where he could actually continue his education. And that's how he moved to Minnesota. So at the time, when I came, he was already in Minnesota. And so I, you know, I just stayed there. Of course, it was a big shock on the... I came in January, the weather was really cold, it was harsh. So you know, I did not hesitate when he was like, "you want to just stay home for a few years?". I'm was like, "absolutely!. I don't want to go out in this weather". That's for sure. And so, you know, and so that's, that's how I that's how we stayed in Minnesota. And we kind of you know, as every year, we will be like, you know, we need to move to a warmer state. But then we were thinking about a good place for the kids education. And we realized Minnesota was one of the states that offered a good education program for the kids. I think that was the main reason why even though the weather was harsh, and we we felt like we should move each time we thought about the kid and just stay back. Yeah. Barbara Sabino Pina 13:55 So coming back a little bit a few minutes ago, when you mentioned about your career. You mentioned that eventually, you started coming here to didn't work at the beginning. And then just started to do like following certain steps in order to learn English and all these other things. And eventually, you end up in the career that you are at the moment. Um, I was wondering if you could talk a little bit about like, the first position that you got, or the first job that you got here in the United States, and how that eventually got you to the place that you are at the moment. Nasmath Aldrin 14:25 Okay, okay. Um, you know, actually, when I came in 2001, in September, and September 11 happened, right. And so, when I was going to start working, I was wondering, you know, which fields will I go in that will not, you know, impact my, you know, where I will not be put down or look down at all, you know, and because, you know, there was a lot of anxiety at the time, you know, considering I was of Muslim faith. And so being that I studied nursing back home, we both thought, you know, why don't you stay in healthcare. And, you know, in health care, you just go, you will care for people, people will very quickly see to your heart and see that, you know, you are just there to help them. And so I started here as a nursing assistant. And I worked, the first place I worked, it's called "Volunteers of America". It's a nursing home, ah, in Maple, Maple Woods. And so I started working there at the time as an nurse assistant, of course, and I worked there for just a few months, at some point, I just did not like the culture. So I moved from that company, and I went from there to another company called "Serenity". And that was in White bear, and it was closer to our house actually. So that way, I stayed, you know, while I took some classes at Kaplan for my nursing, and eventually, you know, got my license to work as a nurse. And when I got my license to work as a nurse, actually, I was sponsored by another company, to the Presbyterian homes, Presbyterian homes and services, and this is a company that sponsor nurses actually from abroad. So my husband got the, you know, to know about them, and to one of his colleagues at work. And so, through that company, you know, they really helped me to even all the classes that I got the kind of guide me to, to get, you know, my nursing degree here, and so, and, of course, I left serenity that that's what the last place I worked at an Nursing assistance. And so, I went, I started my career as a nurse with Presbyterian homes. And one day, for a few years, I, I went from there at some point, as you know, I went into management, I went from being a floor nurse into, you know, clinical manager, and then just the stress of you know, walk and managing my kids with you know, going up in all I decided, you know, I needed to go back and work as the as a floor nurse. And so, you know, I went back you know, to this simply serenity where I had previously worked as a nursing assistant because I like the culture there. And so, I worked there as a nurse again as the flow nurse for a few years you know, just managing with my kids age and different activities that they had. And of course, you know, after a few years, I go into leadership there as well (laughs). And you know, started managing the flow nurses then I went in managing for the bed Transitional Care Unit and in the year you know, after a while, you know, I got tired again about management and I went into homecare. So in homecare, I worked mainly with Fairview, Fairview services, and then you know, and my kids now, back to college, I decided to tone it down. And I work currently as the, as an admission of... director of admission at Presbyterian homes. It's only 10 minutes away from home for me, which is really convenient. And the kids are not here anyway, they are all you know, in college and so that's good one. I like my schedule of you know, Monday through Friday and having my weekends that allow me to travel away and travel, you know, of course one being visited my kids but also for business. Because you know, in between them my husband and I decided we needed... we needed to supplement our income, we needed to diversify our assets. And so we went into business, which has been, I will say, tremendous, you know, we have provided me the tremendous growth, personal growth. And I believe, you know, that also contributed to the growth in leadership that I experienced throughout my career. Yeah, Barbara Sabino Pina 20:29 Wow, that sounds like a long journey that guided you to be more happy, like in a happier spot for sure. Um, so you talked about, well we've been talking about many things. But I was, I'm wondering, since you came to this country, I can hear that you were surrounded by many people that helped you, in many support that you got it, but I'm pretty sure you also experienced many challenges, and many obstacles, to also get to the place you are. So I would like to know, if you could share a little bit about Who were those people that helped you? Like, uplift you to the place that you are? Or what were those events that help you to where you are? And what were those challenges that you had to face in order to get to the place that you are right now. Nasmath Aldrin 21:26 Thank you, thank you. Actually, you know, I... This is how I came to see challenges, right?. Challenges, I see them as an opportunity to grow. Okay, and I will say, my growth started from being a floor nurse. One of the challenges I faced initially at work was the language. Not too much the language but the accent, right, I knew I had an accent (laughs), there was no discussing that, but a few of the challenges were, you know, where it was kind of thrown at my face, you know, that... you know, either I mean, I can see where, you know, somebody may not hear me, or may not understand me, right? by the way, but I was very, very aware of that. And I actually, you know, will be the first to tell people I know, I have an accent. So and, you know, being a nurse at many times, I have to educate my patients. So I will always take the time to be slow. But also repeat myself, I will ask them, you know, to ask me because I will repeat myself, as many times needed for them to understand me. Because that was very important for the care, right? but that many occasions, you know, I really felt that, you know, either because of, you know, their own issues that they had, you know, that's really how I take it because I came across so many nice people, so many people who Oh, wow, "you speak so many languages" or "you also speak...?" or "how many languages you speak? "and "you just come to US and you're able to, you know, converse?", I'm like, Yeah, so I came across people like that, but I also came across, you know, many people who, but only made me strive to get better at my you know, at my communication, I will say, so, any challenge, that's why I only consider any challenge being an opportunity to grow, okay?. Of course, you know, Presbyterian homes and services was you know, as a company helped me initially to help me with you know, ESL helped me actually with my class, my courses with Kaplan, Kaplan University and getting my nursing. So, um, so, there were, you know, first was really tremendous in, in me, you know, going back to my nursing career in this country. And the other day, I will say, I will attributes you know, a lot of my growth also to the fact that I was not afraid to work hard. Not at all. And I was not afraid to, you know, to really share with people my heart, part my heart in anything that I did. One thing that I learned from my dad, you know, I learned from my dad and also one of my dear Professor at all nursing school in Benin was anything that you decide to do, do it right! You do it once do it Right. Right?, and, you know, don't give opportunity to be questioned. And so I value that a lot. And that was one of the things that helped me. I, I, you know, I, I always give, I always put my best in anything that I was doing. And I believe initially, that's what allowed me to go from a flow nurse quickly to just grow in leadership. And the other thing that I will attribute my growth, my personal growt to actually is the environment, you know, that I came at that I came through with the business opportunity that my husband and I started, right and so, we... the business actually came as a package along with a coaching mentorship program that, the name is BWW stands for bridge worldwide. And so Britt worldwide was just a group of entrepreneurs, right who were committed to helping people grow, personally. And the goal in our business is kind of related to the growth in our personal growth. And so I fell in love with reading personal growth book, right? As I was building my business, and, you know, in the opportunity, I had to associate with like-minded people, you know, with people who are really upwardly mobile, and, you know, going after a goal in life, and that, that was really unique, you know, that was unique, and I believe that shaped, I believe that that shaped who I am today. Barbara Sabino Pina 26:59 Yeah, that is really, really beautiful way to see challenges, I really like the way you explain them, and how you were also to use them as a way to kind of grow and see them, as you said, an opportunity. Um, I think all of these things are also kind of related to, you know, our beliefs, and mindset, and all these systems. So I want to ask you, what do you think? Or what, what is your definition for faith? Like, what does faith mean for you? And if it has changed over the years, and if so, has it changed, because like, when you moved to United States?was your, were your previous experiences, from your job?, in your marriage?, with your children? have they also helped shape the way you see faith, and religion? Um, and yeah, just talk what it means for you. Nasmath Aldrin 28:05 Thank you, thank you. Um, you know, of course, you know, I go, I grew up, knowing that there was one God, that we were all, you know, that we were all, who created us all. And that is anything that would be, right? believing in that God, even though he, we cannot see Him, we cannot touch him. Okay, and so that, that, that really fit to me, is believing that in anything that I'm doing, that there is a higher power, you know, that is actually guiding my step. And knowing that, you know, I can go back, I can go back to him at any time, why that you will guide me, and that any challenges that come also are could be a test of my faith, but or could be on, like I said, an opportunity for me to grow even at the test for my faith, it is also an opportunity for me to grow, but being able to see that, right? and then just, you know, take it that way and find you know, find out from people who are aware, you know, I want to be, right? and taking guidance, right from them and in reading a lot, reading a lot, you know, has helped me grow my faith as a person. Yes, I had the faith but the challenges made me do that fit much stronger, right?, every opportunity of anxiety of scarcity. You know, kind of reminded me Hey, you know what? in up and low, right? there is no challenge tha\ he could put in front of me that he does not already have the solution for. But that solution will only come in trusting him. Right that I was, I was, you know, I was in good hands, and that the answer will come in in the right time. And just keep moving forward and doing and choosing to do the right thing. Yeah. Really the belief in that one thing? Yeah. Barbara Sabino Pina 30:22 absolutely. Yes. Kind of, continue talking about faith? And like, what do you believe? In all these belief systems that you have? What do you think it means for you to be an immigrant? Who is also African And who is also Muslim living in the United States? And how has your faith helped you? Like, through... all this transitioning that you went from your native country, to a foreign country that you have lived for multiple years? Now? Nasmath Aldrin 31:17 I believe, of course, United States is the greatest states, I believe, right? In the world, I mean, in the world, right. There is, you know, we can um, we can say all, you know, we can complain, we can do, we can say so many things, right?. But it still remains that great country, it still remains that country where that freedom of thinking, that freedom of enterprise, that free enterprise is, and that's one thing that I appreciate a lot about United States. Now, of course, you know, whether it's US or whether it's anywhere else, ignorance, I believe, is one of the main reasons for, you know, for, you know, thinking Ill about one fit one region versus the other. I mean, God is God, right, there is no other we call we call it Allah, right. And I believe we believe in, in God, we believe in His messengers, while the prophet we believe in all of them. We believe in that one day where we will all get called back to him, we believe in His angel, and then knowing all that, you know, really strengthened my faith. It strengthened me, you know, knowing that, you know, whatever somebody else may think, of me does not define me. Right? And knowing and you know, trusting, in his hand of protection over me and my family, and trusting in his, you know, in his guidance, and just moving forward, you know, and without too much baggage without too much anxiety. Right. And so, that's really what I believe in, and my faith has helped me a lot to stay grounded. You know, and, and, you know, it has helped me to raise my kids as well. And helping them understand, you know, many things that, you know what?, usually, it's the ignorance that acts, you know, ah, you know, the ignorance that acts selfishly, and then most of the time, it's just because somebody has their own issues, you know, that can be transmitted that can be portrayed in an ill way, right?,in a yes, in a hurtful way, or things like that. But no human being a human being we all, we all will answer to him one day. And yeah, yeah, the US has been a great country for us. Barbara Sabino Pina So good to hear. Um, so how does your identity this kind of has, you cannot cover a little bit about this in the previous question, but I want to rephrase it a little differently. So how does your identity as an immigrant African Muslim woman has shaped the way you see the world and the way you behave and the basically who you are as a person? Nasmath Aldrin That's a That's a great question. I will say, you know, coming from a country where we really believe in togetherness, right, we really believe so much in helping each other. I mean, even though, you know, we don't have a lot, but we really believe in, you know, that togetherness, that, you know, helping each other. And, you know, that just brings strength to all of us, right?. And so that has helped me, of course, come in here and not having, you know, immediate family, I didn't really have, I didn't really have much fun, right? There was that... there was, you know, a little bit of preconceived ideas, you know, what is this person gonna think of me, and what is that person, so I didn't really make a friend by the way, but, you know, after I started walking, you know, and I will say, with the improvements in my English, it helped my self-image as well, right?, and... of course, with the, the environments that I had a chance to be part of will BWW, it helped me a lot to raise my self-image. And as my self-image raised, I realized that we really are all just the same. We all just yearn for the same thing in life, we all want peace of mind, right? We want great health, we want you know, they are just those basic things that we all want. Right? And...but the environment, you know, that we grew up in, may make us have some preconceived ideas about one person or the other, or one religion or the other and things like that. But it's, I will say, you know, that togetherness helped me when I, when I came across this business opportunity. And when I had the opportunity to meet on, you know, this team of entrepreneurs in this environment, I just felt home, I really felt home. And I was like, you know, I don't have to be afraid here. You know, nobody's judging me. You know, nobody's judging me for who I am, you know, it's just me, and we are all here, together, learning from each other growing together, you know, as a person, that's what I will say, that was huge... in umm huge contributing in, you know, what shaped me and, and, of course, I found a game that I found here, that family, family-like, atmosphere, even though we are all from different places of the world, and, and things like that I found back here, you know, in this environment, and that helped me a lot. And, you know, and then I also realized that there was really nothing to be afraid of, you know, that, wherever I am, I could really be freely, you know, speak my mind. And, of course, knowing that, you know, that freedom that we all have my freedom stop, when I'm...where at that place, where I try to infringe on somebody else's freedom. Right, and so, but it has helped, it has helped me that, you know, that togetherness, that spirit of, you know, helping each other, you know, coming here, in the fit growing, you know, in an environment where, you know, those values were, were very key, they kind of define this helped me a lot here to just trust that in any way God brought me here for a reason. And so, you know, I will just follow whatever path he has for me. And in the end, it will all be good. Yeah, I hope that answered (laughs). Barbara Sabino Pina Yeah, it did. Absolutely. It actually did touch a little bit about misconceptions. And you said a little bit about how people can have ideas about certain people or certain religions. So I'm wondering if you could elaborate a little bit more on like what are, a few misconceptions that people have, or you believe people have about Muslims. And I'm like, what, if you would like to share a little bit of how have you experienced those yourself? And how that has helped you to like, you mentioned this a little bit about it, but like how this has helped you do see other religions and yourself even more stronger or more open as well. Nasmath Aldrin Yeah, well, misconception I will say, you know, I'm I know that one of the big contributing factor to this misconception also, I will say, when it comes to my religion, you know, being a Muslim came from after that of September 11. Okay, I just came here to US, right?, I came in January, and then September 11 happened. And then initially, you know, I could not, I mean, it's hard to hide that you're Muslim (laughs). But, you know, it's like many people, I, you know, I saw that, you know, they saw Muslim as, you know, terrorist, and, you know, things like that, of course, initially, it was hard and actually raising my kids, you know, how do you sit them down and explain to them, this is not what, this is not really, what...what being a Muslim is, right?. These are people who choose, you know, who have their own agenda, really has nothing to do with the religion. And these are just people who have their own agenda. And under the name of being Muslim, you know, they fight to just, you know, do bad things, why they fight to just, but that has nothing to do with religion, Islam is a unifying religion, you can see it even in how we stand in the Muslim pray, right? There is no space between us. So, basically, you go in there, you may be from Africa, you may be from India, you may be from any, any corner of the world. Right, when you get on that road to pray, we all get so close to each other. Right? It's actually a religion that bring us together. But at the same time, you know, when people decide under the name of religion to, you know, to just kill and do things like that, right? it sounds, um, it's hard, but I think that has that slowly, that event, slowly, I think... it increases the awareness of leaders in the Muslim community, right?, where you know, where I pray, or the mosque, to just be an opportunity for any of us to educate people. So initially, I was afraid, but then I just, you know, of course, people saw my heart, right? in anything that I was doing. And I had the opportunity many times at work, whether it be at work, you know, to just tell people that not who that's not who we are. That's really not what we are about. You know, and, and, of course, you know, that I believe that help that raised the awareness, or it raised the awareness and it's still going on, I know the awareness of the religion itself. And I remember my kids studying Islam in school, and it was a great opportunity, you know, to help them yes, you see this, you know what?, that this is what this is, this is what our, our footage, and this is not what we about, you know, terrorism is not what we are about. Right? And then understanding that Islam actually acknowledges every of the other religions, right, in the, in the sixth pillar of faith. Right? Our faith is in Allah, God, first, right? our faith in His messengers, right? Our faith in his books, right, our faith in the messengers, which include Abraham, you know, Jesus, everybody, Joseph, all of them. When Muhammad Sallallahu Sallam and our fifth in his book, The Torah, the angel, you know, the Quran or every single one of them, right? This, God umm we believe God sent these books, right to different communities. Why through evolution and at each time, target in the mindset at the time of people and how they were living. Right? And so Jesus came, bringing and doing many miracles. Right? So we believe he brought him and he gave him that power of doing miracles to the ex... the expression of faith. Because at the time people needed to see that, to believe that indeed, there is a God, right? And so through evolution, you know, of a human and all, we believe all those books came. And Mohamed Salah Salem was the last to come with the Quran, again, him in an area in an environment, right?, where the culture was, you know, killing girls, baby girls, right? And, you know, in many, many, many, many violent things were there, you know, initially in the culture, right? The worshipping objects and things like that were predominant at his time. Right? And so in his, in him come in with the Quran to elevate people's consciousness, right, and get them from that, you know, that's mindset and that culture and that way of doing things. And he had to fight for people to actually get to the point where they could believe why he had to clean up completely, right? the cava that place today that we all go and worship as a Muslim that we all yearn to go right and worship, which is maca. Maca was taught completely overtaken by idols, right? and for him to be able to bring Islam to people and to bring the awareness of God to people, those things had to happen. And God needed, God needed for those people, or those who will believe to believe. And yes, he had to fight. But that does not mean that Islam is the religion of just fighting and killing, no, not at all. Right? And so for, you know, for people and information is so readily available nowadays. Really, you know, for anybody who really wants to understand Islam, they can pretty much get that information online, you know, but, yeah, that's, you know, that's, that's what I can say. But, you know, just to say that, not just like Christianity, and just like, you know, and Islam is just one way that God chose to bring, you know, to raise people's consciousness and make them understand that there is a God in that you do good, you will see good, and you do bad, you will find back as well. Barbara Sabino Pina Yeah, yeah, thanks for sharing that. Um, for those people that might know little to nothing about Islam or Muslims, especially here in the United States. How would you describe what does being a Muslim looks like to them? Nasmath Aldrin I would say being a Muslim. Ah, you know what, let me get your question, right. How will I describe... how will I describe a Muslim to them? Barbara Sabino Pina Yeah, to someone who doesn't, who knows little to nothing about Islam? Nasmath Aldrin Okay. So I will say it mostly it's just a human being, like anybody else, right? and we believe in the uniqueness of Allah, right?. And, you know, we pray five times a day, you know, again, a way for Allah to remind us, right? those, each time that you get on that road, remember I created you, right? and so five times a day, we are required to go and do those prayers for that reason. Because the more we are reminded of who's we are, right and where we come from. It helped us not only stay grounded, right?, but it helped us just stay on the right path that he has, you know, cleared us to be cleared all of us to come here for a reason, right? with a mission. And these five prayers a day is a reminder for us each time of where we came from, who's we are, who we are. Okay, and that's just, that just, those are just an expression. Of course, you know, we are... he, what we like, those are killers of, you know, of our religion. But when you think about it, it just a way for us to stay humble, to stay grounded, and know, where we came from. And a reminder for us each of those five times a day, that, you know, we are God's all, all God's kids. And we need to do the right thing, right. So it's just like, if you think about it, you know, you take a shower five times a day, how much debt will you carry? Not much. Right? So, yeah, oh, you wash your hand five times a day? How much? No. for the Deaf stain, you know, within, you know, that purity of spirits. Yes. Barbara Sabino Pina Awesome. Is there anything that we didn't get to talk about in this interview today, that you would like to cover or to talk about? Maybe any comments or any additional thoughts about anything that was said or maybe not said today? Nasmath Aldrin Um, you know, I will say, one thing I will say is encourage anybody, you know, like I said, earlier, information is so readily available nowadays. You know, and in the Muslim community itself, you know, we organize, so many opportunity for anybody to come in and learn, even as we are currently fasting, right. And again, we fast and be nice, mainly, again, to worship God, by then to keep that spirit period, which is actually good for our health itself. You know, this is, you know, a period during the year where just those fasting actually are very good for your, of course, for your spirit, for your spirit, but also for your body. So, we embrace that. And for anybody who is not, you know, how, who really wants to learn about Islam, so many organizations, by the Minnesoat, itself having a in an Islamic community, Minnesota, okay, let's CEAI. There are so many so much information available, even online, Right? there there is translation of Hadith of the Prophet of his way of living, they are translation of even the Quran, you know, the Quran, you know that to just to help people be aware. So anybody who is looking for the information, the information is available. It's just going and finding it. When, because anytime you actually go and find information, it's just like, you are bringing light into darkness, right? And anytime you do that, it helps increase your awareness. It helps raise your consciousness. It helps you in this thing. It helps you see everybody as one as equal. No distinction. Doesn't matter. We don't I don't see color. I don't, right? I don't see. Good. I don't see I noticed none of that. I just see human beings, all of us. Just unique in our way, right? masterpiece, each of us a masterpiece. Absolutely. And he is so much more than we think we are capable of. Yeah. Barbara Sabino Pina Oh, so true. Well, thank you so much for your time today Nasmath I think I learned so much for you and I hope everyone who listens to this conversation, this interview learns a lot for you as well, thank you so much again. Nasmath Aldrin You're welcome my pleasure (laughs)
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