Oral History with Kim Yue (2022)
3/22/2022 • 36:13
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
Augsburg, nurse, concepts, nursing, community, class, experiences, patients, change, feel, project,
hospital, DNP, engaged, advocate, civic engagement, stand, new jersey, hoping, home
SPEAKERS
Kim Yue, Elaine Eschenbacher
E... Show more
Oral History with Kim Yue (2022)
3/22/2022 • 36:13
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
Augsburg, nurse, concepts, nursing, community, class, experiences, patients, change, feel, project,
hospital, DNP, engaged, advocate, civic engagement, stand, new jersey, hoping, home
SPEAKERS
Kim Yue, Elaine Eschenbacher
Elaine Eschenbacher 00:00
Thank you for joining us today for this oral history project with Augsburg University and the Kettering
foundation. We're exploring the concept of the citizen professional in higher education. My name is
Elaine Eschenbacher. I'm the assistant provost for experiential learning and meaningful work. Could
you please introduce yourself for the recording?
Kim Yue 00:43
My name is Kimberly Yue. I'm a pediatric nurse practitioner and a doctoral student here at Augsburg in
the transcultural nursing leadership program.
Elaine Eschenbacher 00:54
Thank you. Before we continue, I would like to confirm that you consent to be interviewed and having
that interview stored at Augsburg University, in the archives of the library, which will be made available
to the public.
Kim Yue 01:10
I consent.
Elaine Eschenbacher 01:11
Thank you. Tell me a little bit about your educational background and what you're currently studying at
Augsburg.
Kim Yue 01:23
Okay, um, I'm from New Jersey. So, my bachelor's in science in nursing is from William Paterson
University here in New Jersey. About 10 years ago, I graduated with my master's in nursing as a
pediatric nurse practitioner, from Seton Hall University, also in New Jersey. And for my doctorate, I
really wanted to kind of branch out from something that was more mainstream and cookie cutter, I
wanted something that would be more focused on culture and social justice issues. I wanted to learn to
be a better advocate for my patients, and how to just be a better, well rounded, you know, doctoral
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nurse. And I went in my project to focus on cultural issues, which was is not as accepted at all
universities.
Elaine Eschenbacher 02:41
Sounds like you were seeking out the kind of exactly the kind of program that Augsburg has then. Is
that would you say that's true?
Kim Yue 02:48
I would definitely would say that's true. I would say for the past, well, for the first few years before I
entered Augsburg I had been looking at various doctoral programs, but just nothing kind of really felt
like the right fit. But when I met Dr. Miller and Dr. Schuhmacher and had an interview with them, it just
felt like I was home like I was with the people that I'm supposed to be with it, it just immediately felt
right. And I knew that this is where I should be to take my practice to where I want it to go.
Elaine Eschenbacher 03:34
Before coming to Augsburg, how did you view yourself as a nurse in relationship to being engaged with
the community?
Kim Yue 03:46
Prior to coming to Augsburg, I kind of made two life changes. I was working in primary care in a very
affluent area and was very engaged with my patients and their families. They did not require a lot of
social support for me. Yet, there's always reasons to advocate for kids. Different issues. I really wanted
to kind of branch out from something that was more mainstream and cookie cutter, I wanted something
that would be more focused on culture and social justice issues. I wanted to learn to be a better
advocate for my patients, and how to just be a better, well rounded, you know, doctoral nurse. And I
went in my project to focus on cultural issues, which was is not as accepted at all universities.
Elaine Eschenbacher 05:21
Um, that's a great description of the kind of different communities you've worked in and how you're
engaging, and being an advocate. What about being able to create change within a system are within
the institution? How did you see yourself as a nurse in relation to that?
Kim Yue 05:45
I'm so sorry. Can you repeat the question? You froze a little.
Elaine Eschenbacher 05:49
Oh, sure. Sorry about that. Before coming to Augsburg? How did you see yourself you talked about
how you saw yourself as a nurse in terms of being engaged in the community? How did you see
yourself in terms of being able to create change within a system or within the institution.
Kim Yue
In my primary care position, I felt very unempowered to create any change. It was a private practice
owned by a single physician, and any changes that I had suggested went nowhere, unfortunately.
There were definitely things that we could have done to advocate for patients. But that, that,
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unfortunately, fell on deaf ears. Once I started at my new position, in which I've been there, about three
years now, three and a half years, very receptive to ideas and change. It is frustratingly slow, but I
guess, as all hospital systems are, but yeah, they're very open to any kind of suggestions. As soon as I
suggested anything for my doctoral project, they just jumped all over them, like I could have had, like 10
projects that would have been viable there. And I would have had support with any of them. Here, I feel
like I definitely make change. I co-chair our business resource group (BRG), which within the hospital,
it's called power, it's dedicated to social justice. So within the hospital system and within the community,
so we try to bring issues to light to the staff, to the patients, we try to affect change in that way. We
have. We have a voting webinar series. We have financial literacy series. We help out other BRGs with
any of their causes. So I definitely know that I can make a change here. Well, it sounds like as you're
describing it, it sounds like the specific context makes a big difference. But it's interesting, because you
changed contexts at about the same time that you started studying in the program at Augsburg is that
right?
Kim Yue 08:42
I was working there for about a year, and then maybe a year and a couple of months COVID hit, and of
course that really brought to light so many inequities and social concerns but when COVID hit it was a
whole other level where we went from seeing patients all day long to now I'm trying to figure out how do
I keep them home where we can watch them safely and care for them via phone. You know, just
because COVID hit doesn't mean that babies you know with congenital heart defects don't get born
anymore, they continue to get born, and so we spearheaded a program where we we got scales and
batteries and thermometers and all sorts of supplies and shipped them directly to their home so that
they could care for their babies and we could get the data from them. Because the insurance
companies don't cover any of that. But they can't have a newborn at home with congenital heart
disease, where we don't know how much are they gaining every day? How much weight have they
gained? Have they lost any weight? So we were able to do that it just really brought to light so many, so
many issues. So COVID hit our area in March, and by September I was I was at Augsburg.
Elaine Eschenbacher 10:26
Wow. Since being at Augsburg, how has your view of your role as a nurse changed? Or has it
changed? And if so how?
Kim Yue 10:57
I definitely did not think of nurses as large scale advocates for general populations, I definitely was
always on an individual basis, one to one with my patients, (being) fierce advocates for whatever they
needed. But to think more globally, that nurses could really affect change, for large populations or for
you know, the community at large. I did not see that role as much as I do now.
Elaine Eschenbacher 11:39
Could you describe a little bit about what you experienced at Augsburg that made you see that
differently?
Kim Yue 11:48
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I mean, just every class that we've taken has really been such an eye opening experience into just
society, into politics into socio-economic issues. Everything through a transcultural lens, a social justice
lens, and emancipatory nurse lens. To hear about it emancipatory nursing was just kind of like, where
have these rockstars been all my life? Like, these are my people! Where have they been? We don't
really talk about them enough. Like, this is a thing, but they're very hidden away. And I think I think it's
amazing that the nurses are out there advocating for social justice change and for change, you know, in
communities and society. Because people need to listen to us we have we have a holistic view of
people's lives, not just their health, but every every part of their life.
Elaine Eschenbacher 13:10
It sounds like, even if those ideas were kind of new to you being exposed to them in the Augsburg
program, you resonated with them really quickly.
Kim Yue 13:24
Absolutely, I can't tell you how many times I've read in a book. I'm like, that's what I've been saying all
along. Yes, this is what makes sense to me. This is like a validation of what you kind of knew, but it's
like in print, now somebody else feels that way too. You're not alone. You know, there's other people
out there that are working to affect change, and that just empowers you to feel like you can do that as
well.
Elaine Eschenbacher 13:56
That's awesome. For the next question, I'm going to list off a couple of different concepts and ask you if
if they are concepts that you remember discussing in any of your classes, and if so, which classes so
citizen professional or a citizen nurse, civic engagement or civic skills? Are those concepts that you
remember from particular classes?
Kim Yue 14:21
Yes, definitely. A Seat at the Table with with Dr. Clark.
Elaine Eschenbacher 14:27
Anything else you'd like to say about that?
Kim Yue 14:29
That was really an eye opening class. It was interesting. Every part of it was interesting to learn about it
definitely was not something that I knew those skills before. Power mapping was just so intriguing to me
that I've actually incorporated it into my DNP project. So yeah, I mean, it was it was, it was very
intriguing to me. And then, and then the hearing about emancipatory nursing, which is was, that was
like the favorite part of my class. To learn that process and those skills was really, that's something that
I will definitely take with me forever.
Elaine Eschenbacher 15:21
Nice. Some of these questions overlap a little bit because we're hoping that if we ask them in different
ways, it'll maybe bring forth different ideas. So if it feels like that it's kind of intentional. Can you tell me
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a little bit more about what experiences are kind of pedagogical practices in the classroom or in your
coursework, helped you gain an understanding of the role of a citizen professional or citizen nurse?
Kim Yue 15:53
Well, in that class, we did we had the author come speak to us, and his name is escaping me.
Elaine Eschenbacher 16:01
Oh, no, that's okay. I think Harry Boyte.
Kim Yue 16:05
Yes. Yeah. So in that class, we had Harry Boyte come and speak with us, and that just brought
everything to life. It brought the book to life, definitely. And to hear directly from somebody who is so
directly involved in social justice work was pretty amazing. And I have a lot of reverence and awe for
him.
Elaine Eschenbacher 16:39
Do you feel better equipped to lead change either in or outside of healthcare institutions after your
educational experiences at Augsburg? And if so, how?
Kim Yue 16:54
That would have been a very easy yes or no question. The answer is yes. I keep track of all the
concepts that we've gone over in all of the classes. And I can just tell in my everyday experience at
work, that I see these concepts throughout my day, and yes, I do feel equipped to make change and I
am making change. So at work, and my DNP project will be a large part of that.
Elaine Eschenbacher 17:36
Would you mind describing a little bit about your DNP project?
Kim Yue 17:39
Sure. My DNP project is called Kim's lovve project. And LOVVE, love stands for LGBTQ outpatient vital
and valuable education for healthcare providers. So it will be a four class advocacy program for the
LGBTQ community within within my hospital. There's a lot of intersectional issues where I work. So we
explore intersectionality, we explore history of LGBTQ issues. We're exploring discrimination and
oppression and how those those affected social determinants of health and how we can be effective
allies to support them when they come into our hospital, in our spaces, and in the community. I chose
allyship because if you learn allyship for one marginalized community, it really can be applied to any
community and any person that needs allyship. So that's what we're doing.
Elaine Eschenbacher 19:07
Great. How did you come to that idea? What made you decide to design that?
Kim Yue 19:13
So initially, when I came to Augsburg, the LGBTQ community was always a community that I wanted to
work with. Just because wrapping my head around the concept of discriminating against somebody just
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for who they love or who they are just is just so foreign to me. I just don't understand it. And it just felt
like if you look in our community, like a trans black woman is probably the most at risk person that we
could have walk into our in the hospital. So I wanted to help that population.
Elaine Eschenbacher 20:12
So thinking back on your education at Augsburg and and how the civic skills and these concepts played
into it, what do you think could have helped you better understand civic skills or the concepts that we've
highlighted in this interview? And two part question and what concepts were the most challenging to
kind of grasp?
Kim Yue 20:35
I was never really a good social studies student in school, so when it comes to government, politics,
how everything works, I'm was just never really very knowledgeable of that. I think that the class
definitely hit on, you know, how to try to affect change within your community. I feel maybe a little bit
more civics basics for those of us who are not that politically engaged, might be helpful.
Elaine Eschenbacher 21:24
That makes good sense. Yeah.
Kim Yue 21:25
But, but the concepts that I learned were very easily applicable.
Elaine Eschenbacher 21:35
Did any of those concepts impact either your current practice or your understanding of the profession of
nursing? You actually talked to a couple questions ago about how you see these concepts every day?
Kim Yue 22:06
I do. I see a lot of the concepts from all of Augsburg? I definitely feel like I'm more in tune to civic
engagement, like locally and nationally, and internationally. Right now, especially. So I mean, it
definitely has informed me - have I have I acted on that - (saying) I am more engaged? I don't think I'm
more engaged then where I was, I was always somebody who read up on the issues, read up about the
people running for office, I always voted. But have I gotten a group together in my community to try to
change something? No, because I'm a little busy with my project. Hopefully, someday.
Elaine Eschenbacher 23:16
Yeah. Well, and we definitely believe that civic engagement can take place through your work too,
right? So it doesn't, it doesn't necessarily have to be some external project that you do on your own
time. And certainly, I think your DNP project is a great example of that. And are there other
experiences, even little micro experiences that come to mind where you've kind of put some of those
concepts into practice?
Kim Yue 23:47
Well, hopefully, if this can can happen, we're trying very hard now that COVID has gone away, I will try
to be having like a town hall meeting of the community within the hospital, to gather some stories to
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help inform my class on my classes that I will be teaching for my DNP project. So it hasn't happened
yet. But I'm very hopeful that it will. Because I feel very strongly that the community needs to be
involved. They need to have ownership and they should tell us what what are the problems that they
experienced? We shouldn't just be assuming, just because I've read 500 articles about what people
experience, it doesn't necessarily mean that that's going to be their experience. I mean, if
intersectionality has taught us anything, it's that every single person has a different intersection of
issues. So if I don't hear directly from the community, I'm not going to know if there's any one particular
thing that that has happened to them that I would not have known about. So hoping that will, hopefully
that will happen.
Elaine Eschenbacher 25:11
Yeah. When you when you imagine those townhall meetings what's your vision? How do you see it
playing out?
Kim Yue 25:20
So it can be a little daunting to stand up there and say, "What problems have you had?", because I will
be the face of the place that possibly could have been causing these problems. So I'm going to be
stressing that, you know, we should hear the good things as well as the bad because the good things
needs to be reinforced as well, as bad things need to be changed. Because of the some restrictions,
still with COVID, it will be a somewhat small group. So I'm retargeting some community leaders within
the LGBTQ community in our town in the city. And hopefully, they will be able to make it and and
hopefully, they'll be able to have good things and some constructive criticism as well. If we can manage
it, I'm also hoping to have a special town hall meeting just with kids and their parents.
Elaine Eschenbacher 26:32
Nice.
Kim Yue 26:34
Because I'm a pediatric nurse, I know that there's other issues just related to kids that you know, that
adults might not have that issue. So yeah, we're hoping to do that as well.
Elaine Eschenbacher 26:47
I hope it works for you.
Kim Yue 26:51
Me too. I keep putting it off hoping that it'll go away and we can meet in person because these are very
intimate issues. It's kind of impersonal to do that over Zoom, although, if anything has taught us those
past two years is that we can form very quickly, we can form some pretty strong relationships over
Zoom. You know, my cohort and I are very tight. We're very supportive of each other. And so I'm sure
that we could convey that over Zoom, but it's always easier to do in person.
Elaine Eschenbacher 27:33
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So which experiences at Augsburg stand out to you as meaningful opportunities to learn and reflect and
kind of integrate lessons across coursework, across your coursework and community engaged
learning? So there's a lot there. It's possible that none do stand out?
Kim Yue 27:54
Well, I mean, as I said earlier, every class I learned just a little bit more that just broadens my horizons
even more. So it's, the classwork is so carefully constructed that it just builds upon each other, which is
just brilliant. So um, I would say that the cosmologies class was probably stood out for me, which I
going into that class, I was like, Oh, I do not know what I'm getting to here. I'm not sure about this. This
is this just doesn't sound like something I'm gonna be able to grasp. But actually, it really, it definitely, it
spoke right to me. And, you know, reinforced the fact that we're, you know, we're all connected. And
yes, so actually inspired me to finish my Reiki training. So I became a Reiki Master after that, because
it just kind of like, reignited my passion for that. And so yeah, that was and so when you start to look at
everybody in the world, as somebody that is a part of you. It definitely makes you view everything
differently.
Elaine Eschenbacher 29:26
Is there anything that you'd wish you'd learned at Augsburg but haven't yet?
Kim Yue 29:37
Well, now I still have a year to go. Um I wouldn't say that it's something I haven't learned. But
something that unfortunately our cohort has not been able to do is to go on a lot of the immersions. And
so I feel like those are really huge opportunities for some life changing learning right there. So we are
hoping to go this coming year. To a little bit of it. I think that's really part of the whole program.
Elaine Eschenbacher 30:28
You talked a little bit about this kind of at the beginning, but how has the pandemic changed your view
of the profession of nursing?
Kim Yue 30:37
Hmm. It's changed so much. I mean, I've always known that there was you know, that individual nurses
could be at risk for violence and things like that, but I never really thought of us as being a population
that would be so at risk, just physically from from something that we could not control, like the virus. So
watching, you know, watching co workers get sick was It was horrifying. You know, and then just
thatimmense stress every day of am I bringing this home to my family? I don't want to be around my
family because I want to protect them. You know? Anytime you sneeze or something you were like, oh,
gosh, isolate me. Yeah, it was a super amount of stress. Nursing was always a stressful profession, but
COVID just took that up 10 notches. And now there's so much. We're losing so much staff, like they're
they're leaving, but they're not leaving nursing, they're leaving to travel. And then we're getting travelers
in and those are not the nurses that we're always used to, and they're very good. And we're very
grateful that they're here. But that, that change that flux, it's just it's rough. It's a lot of turnover, the
staffing has been so difficult. And I'm not even the staff nurse, but I feel the crunch, you know, so when
my patients are in the ICU, I will go to help support them. Because I want to make sure my patients are
going to be okay. But I want to make sure that the nurses are okay, too. And so it definitely it's changed
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a lot about nursing. So I have to give every undergrad nursing student that's in the program right now
huge kudos because it definitely, it's hard. It's hard to look at the progression right now. Yeah, it's been
difficult.
Elaine Eschenbacher 33:13
Thank you. Do you feel like you've been able to have a voice in making decisions in this constant
changing landscape of healthcare?
Kim Yue 33:24
I have a voice to a point. I'm supported to a point. I wouldn't say that, my institution, while it's very
supportive of everything that I've suggested, it's also still just not fully 100% supportive of APNs and
nurse practitioners working to the fullest extent. That's definitely a battle that we need to forge ahead
with. We kind of hope that COVID would have kind of changed that and it didn't. So, yes, if there's
anything that I suggest, they're like, carte blanche, as long as it's not going to cost us money, you can
do whatever you want. But once it gets to the point where well, we need more staff or we need to do
this, we should do that. If it's going to cost any money. We're done, that's it. And most things do cost
money. Yes. Yes. Well, to be effective, usually.
Elaine Eschenbacher 34:44
So now you probably have a good sense of what we're going for. You've heard all my questions. Is
there anything else that you would like to share that I didn't ask kind of in this category of things?
Kim Yue 34:55
I would to just say that Augsburg's biggest treasure is their professors. They're phenomenal. And I am
so incredibly grateful to them. That's it.
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Show less
Oral History with Benjawan "Benji"
Jearanaivitthayakul (2022)
3/29/2022 • 38:14
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
Augsburg, nurse, people, patient, community, dialysis, sex trafficking, clark, problem, life, helped,
concepts, feel, educate, project, understand, thought, experience, receive, immerse
SPEAKERS... Show more
Oral History with Benjawan "Benji"
Jearanaivitthayakul (2022)
3/29/2022 • 38:14
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
Augsburg, nurse, people, patient, community, dialysis, sex trafficking, clark, problem, life, helped,
concepts, feel, educate, project, understand, thought, experience, receive, immerse
SPEAKERS
Benjawen Jearanaivitthayakul, Elaine Eschenbacher
Elaine Eschenbacher 00:07
Thank you for joining me today, Benji for this oral history project with Augsburg University and the
Kettering Foundation. We're exploring the concept of the citizen professional in higher education. My
name is Elaine Eschenbacher, I'm the assistant provost for experiential learning and meaningful work
at Augsburg and I'm partnering with Dr. Katie Clark on this project. Could you please introduce yourself
for the recording?
Benjawen Jearanaivitthayakul 00:35
Hi, my name is Benji. So I am a nursing student of DNP FNP program at Augsburg I am in the second
year like a middle of the road. So right now I'm working at inpatient dialysis at Mayo Clinic hospital.
Elaine Eschenbacher 01:00
Before we continue, I just want to confirm that you consent to being interviewed and having an audio
recording of this interview stored at Augsburg University and it could be made available to the public.
Do you consent to that?
Benjawen Jearanaivitthayakul 01:13
Yes
Elaine Eschenbacher 01:14
Thank you. Um, okay, so we'll start out, could you just tell me a little bit about your education
background, and what you're currently studying at Augsburg.
Benjawen Jearanaivitthayakul 01:26
So my current I mean, my education background is I received undergrad nursing degree at Century
College. And then I went to RN BSN online at Western Governor. And then I went back, and then I
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went back to the college a couple years ago to get FNP DNP program. So, right now I am in the FNP
DNP program at Augsburg. So I am in the second year.
Elaine Eschenbacher 02:07
Before you came to Augsburg, how did you view yourself as a nurse in relationship to being engaged in
community.
Benjawen Jearanaivitthayakul 02:16
So when I did undergrad at Century College, so we did some kind of immersion to we did some kind of
project with preschool and also, you know, order adults in the nursing home. That was, like a small
group project to spend a day with them. And some time we do some project by teaching them like a
hand washing in the preschool. So that's kind of like something that I did with community and know
about, you know, spending time with community and spending time with the public. So it really helped
me to see how how nurse related you know, we always educate people, just you know, like, from you
know, from since they are young since they are older. And when I, when I become a nurse, I spend
most of my day with their friend, you know, lifespan, even though I do dialysis, mostly for adults, but
sometimes I have children and babies that require dialysis as well. So I can see, like from the baby to
adult age, like up to 90, over 90. And, but when I did RN, BSN online at Western Governor, it was quite
different. I think the only one course that I get to spend a lot of time with the topic was like a capstone
that I have to do to finish my clinical hours. So I have to in that time, I did like diabetes, prevention of
diabetes. So I just go to a different daycares. And different, what do they call like a nursing home and
collect the information and educate those population about how to prevent diabetes. So, and then when
I came to Augsburg, I feel like you know, especially last semester that we did that we took the course,
Making Room at the Table, with Dr. Clark. She had us to do the field trip. So we went to Breaking Free
and the speaker was really amazing. She spoke to her experience about how she become, you know,
like, a victim, and how she get out of the life. And now she is helping other girl to get out of the life. And
I just feel like that is so powerful. I mean, I have never been that kind of, you know, like experience that
kind of situation to learn from people who were the victim, because it's not easy to get to go there to get
to experience with them. And unless you know somebody, or they really open to do it for you. So I just
think that it really stick with me. And also that project made me do like a final project about sex
trafficking. That helped me like dig a little bit deeper about community about how people we are
uneducated, about sex trafficking in the United States. Because I grew up in a foreign country. So
especially in Thailand, we consider like, you know, third world country, so I understand that why people
over there, why do they sell young girls to be prostitute? Because, you know, social circumstances
because, you know, maybe they don't have enough food to put on the table, or money is so hard for
them to earn. And also, you know, like, women, we don't have a lot of education. So I can see the
perception from that. And I would assume that, you know, like, in the United States, we have, you
know, we are developed country, we grow economic really good. So, I would assume that, you know,
like, sex trafficking would not be the first, you know, like, top priority of this country. But then after I went
to a Breaking Free, and I started to do more research, and they found that, oh, my gosh, it's really eye
opening that, you know, this country has a lot of problem with sex trafficking. And I think, in you know,
especially in Minnesota, I think, is one of the top 10 states that have the most, you know, minors sex
trafficking, and I was shocked. And I thought like, we are so liberal, because I live in the small town in
Rochester, and I did not see that kind of experience much. You know, even, you know, because it's like
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a quiet town. But then, you know, when I think about it, when I go to the city, I can see, you know, the
difference, you know, and the variety, and I can see why sex trafficking can be a problem in Minnesota.
Elaine Eschenbacher 08:11
You touched on some of this already, but I'm going to ask the question anyway, you might have
different things to say. How has your view of the role of a nurse changed since studying at Augsburg?
Or has it changed? And if so, how?
Benjawen Jearanaivitthayakul 08:28
So I started to look at more like, you know, what is the problem in our community? And how can I
support them? And how can I help them? How can I get local, I think when one of the documentary that
Dr. Clark assigned us to watch, I think it's called Poverty Inc. So, that documentary is you know, like
reflecting about, you know, NGOs. How NGOs helped poor country, you know, like, we donate a lot of
money to poor country, right. And we thought we we are helping them but really in that documentary, it
really made me understand that you know, all the money that we donate, maybe we do not generate
the help over there. We just give, give the product so now they are getting used to receiving but not
thinking about how they can you know making the product themselves or how can I how can they start
the business and sometimes it difficult for the local to start a business because the NGO just give
everything for free? How how do local start a business and charge for $10 when another people can
get it for free? Right? That is eye opening for me. Because I used to see, you know, like, when NGO
trying to collect money, and I used to be like giving them money to that. And it's just now like, I just
have to read about like, what kind of, you know, policy? How do they, you know, give money? Or how
do they find money to those country, and now I just started to donate more money for local community.
So if I, if I donate something, I would like to help local people. So then, you know, like I said, then I feel
like, I do the good thing, because I help local people here. That they receive that money, or they use
that money to help the local people.
Elaine Eschenbacher 10:50
I'm going to give you a list of concepts or any of these concepts, citizen professional or citizen nurse
civic engagement or civic skills. Were those discussed in your classes that you've had so far at
Augsburg? And if so, which ones do you remember?
Benjawen Jearanaivitthayakul 11:08
Well, I think they almost all discussed but what I remember is about civic nurses and civic skills. I
remember Dr. Clark invited Dr. Ruth Enestvedt, and then she gave a presentation, and she gave us a
lot of example, about how we can be a civic nurse, how we have civic skills for the citizen nurse. And I
think one of the skills is that we have to, you know, like, reaching out the community, explore the
community. And this is the skill that, you know, I didn't, you know, I didn't realize that. Yeah, we always
think about other things outside of us. But then why don't we think, why don't we start from our
community first. So for example, when I did the final project, I started to dig deeper about sex trafficking
in my community. And I even interview my nurses, you know, like, in my unit. I was shocked that, you
know, the two nurses that I interviewed, they have no idea that we have a lot of sex trafficking in
Minnesota, they have no idea how to effect you know, the victims. And I just thought, Oh, interesting,
you know, like, because this nurses has been nurse for a while, like, at least three year, but they don't
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even know that we have this kind of problem. They assume the same thing as I did that, you know, sex
trafficking is in undeveloped country. So it's not happening in the Minnesota. So I just educate them
about here, what I found out about my research, and you know, and I told them about Breaking Free
and they were like, what? really? did they really happening? And you know, when city I said, Well, you
know what, what I find out that you know, people who have money normally they don't shop for sex
trafficking around the local. So normally they would they would travel. Because people here they have
money, right? So do we have a lot of Doctor, people who have higher salary, so they just drive up to the
city and use the service. So in the research it said, normally, you know, like, middle aged men, they are
the buyer and they have like power they and they shopping around it's just go up drive up for 60 to 70
mile to do to get sex and I just calculated, Rochester and Twin Cities is about 70 mile. And then I
started to dig deeper in about my hospital. How did they educate nurses about sex trafficking at all? So
I just realized that they did have a policy to educate nurses about sex trafficking, However, it's more,
you know, towards emergency, you know, to the ER nurse, rather than the floor nurse. And I think floor
nurse are the person that they should be educated to because they are the person that can spot them,
right? Sometime, you know, like victims, they get hurt or they get injury and they have to stay at the
hospital for a while. And those floor nurses should have knowledge to spot them because they are the
person who spent a day with them.
Elaine Eschenbacher 15:04
It's interesting how you don't see it until somebody opens your eyes and then you can't not see it. Can
you tell me a little bit about what experiences you've had in the classroom, what kind of pedagogical
practices or coursework that really helped you gain an understanding of the role of the citizen
professional or the citizen nurse?
Benjawen Jearanaivitthayakul 15:34
I think Making Room at the Table, give me really, Dr. Clark have a lot of exercise to have us think about
how to be a citizen nurse. So we read the books, and also we did the final project about you know,
people should have to choose one of the projects that they are interested, and, you know, dig deeper
about, you know, your community, and reading the book that related to your topics. And reading the
book that related to the sex trafficking. Dr. Clark gave me one book is called Girls Like Us. So I read the
book, and I was, I was so shocked about many story, in the book. Like how government funding, you
know, lack of resources to help the victims, even some programs, it's just lack of resources. Most of the
program will require that the victim have to, you know, have to be some type of like a drug addict, have
some kind of involved with a drug problem. And I think I remember one of the girls, she did not have a
drug problem, but she wanted to get out of the life. So then she did not qualify for this program. So it's
just eye opening. For me, it's like, you want to help them, but there is no program to fit her. And you
know, what she did she just disappear from the safe house for a while, half a day. And then when she
came back, she and now excitedly said that I have smoke crack. So now I'm eligible for the drug
program that I can get out of the life. And that was eye opening for me that, you know, like many
programs do not fit everybody. And if some people, they don't fit to that requirement, they don't get
help.
Elaine Eschenbacher 18:07
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Do you feel better equipped to lead change either inside or outside of healthcare institutions? Because
of your educational experiences at Augsburg? And if so, how?
Benjawen Jearanaivitthayakul 18:23
So I think I can so because I just feel like, you know, Augsburg, really give me the kind of, you know,
critical thinking, to apply the skills that I have, you know, like, to, to start from, you know, from the local,
and see what I see as a problem. And now, when we see as the problem, and how, how do we fix the
problem. And who, like a stake holder that we need to contact. And how do we reach the support from
other local community, and trying to get their attention and bring that problem to them, so then they can
be aware. And I think, you know, if we started from there, we can gain knowledge, and also we can
gain solution. I mean, I'm a little people, but I think with little people, and if we can get support from the
local, we can make a change.
Elaine Eschenbacher 19:38
So thinking back, and I know you're right in the middle of it, but thinking back on your time at Augsburg
so far, what could have helped you better understand civic skills or these concepts that we've already
highlighted in this interview? So what could have helped you better understand them? And what
concepts or issues were most challenging to understand?
Benjawen Jearanaivitthayakul 20:02
I would like to have more like, you know, experienced field trip. Yeah. So, and I know, it has been two
years that we have, you know, COVID. And we kind of like limits about, you know, like field trip and
going to immerse ourselves to that kind of experience with the local community. When you know, some
community, they even close temporarily, they don't accept you to visit. And you know, I hope that in the
future, we can have more, you know, field trip, and immerse your community more, so then we can
know what the problem is. And then after, you know, we visit, the community is really nice to just brief
discuss about, like a brainstorm about, what did you learn about community today? And how do you
think we can be how we can apply civic skills to this community? How can we improve our community
to be better?
Elaine Eschenbacher 21:18
Were there any concepts or issues that were raised in your classes that were more challenging or to
understand than others?
Benjawen Jearanaivitthayakul 21:36
For example, like a mental health issue, you know, as a nurse, when I see the patient, and, you know,
when they are in psychosis, you know, episode, I feel like I want to help them. And if you think about
our job to help them to get better, right. And, for example, you know, they're, you know, like people who
have schizophrenia, and when they are in the episode of schizophrenic, I just want to give them the
medication to help them calm down, and to feel better. But then, you know, some patient refused the
medications, because they just think, you know, they don't hear that voice anymore. And some people
did think that the voice was calming themselves down. And it's like, a soothing for them. But for me, it
seemed like it's hard to see them going through. It's just, it's an ethical issue. I think it's just, I think, you
know, it's hard to draw the line that what's your ideal, you know, I want to help them to get better, but
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they refuse to receive the med, then. I think one of the assignment that Dr. Clark assigned to watch a
movie about a guy who went through like a psychotic episode and about that whole life. Do you
remember what the movie was? Oh, the movie names, The Soloist. So, that movie really eye opening
for me. And I think that movie just made me feel like now. Now I am the person who just watch, I'm not
the nurse. So I don't need to intervenes. And I just watch, you know, the patient going through and I just
watched him that, you know, they have autonomy to choose what they want to do with their life. They
can choose to be not to receive the medication. And thus it's okay to you know, as long as they don't
harm other people and they don't harm themself. I cannot force them to do anything that they don't
want to. I mean, it's hard to watch them in that episode. But then, you know, to be a civic nurse, you
have to understand that people have choices, and people have freedom to choose that choice.
Elaine Eschenbacher 25:03
Have any of the course concepts that we've been talking about impacted your current practice or
understanding of the profession of nursing?
Benjawen Jearanaivitthayakul 25:14
Yes. So talking about, respecting people choices about a goal of care, or, you know, there are some
time that people, you know, they get tired of dialysis, and they just refuse to receive dialysis. But then,
you know, like, the health care provider trying to manage them and not, you know, having them, you
know, have to go to code blue by having high potassium, so, asking them to do dialysis. And
sometimes people, you know, they just feel like they don't have a choice, or they are forced to do. So I
just, you know, if they are open to talk to me, and I would just address that to the healthcare provider to
their doctor, and maybe we need to have, like a care plan. We need to talk to the, you know, to the
patient and their family, and discuss the goal here, because, you know, he has the patient wishes, and
this is a provider wishes, and is doesn't match. So, we want to do the best for the patient, and the
patient is the person that we are, we are aiming for. So I think, you know, getting through this had really
helped me to think about, we need to respect people, we need to respect patient more. So we need to
value their decision, not just, you know, our perspective that we want to provide them quality of life by
keep doing diagnosis, or do whatever. But did you really ask them? Do they want to do it? Do they want
to go through it? It's just gave me that kind of perspective, like, ethical issue as well, that, you know, we
need to listen to both sides, and have the patient be the persons who pick, you know, the care that they
want, the care that they need the thing that served them the best.
Elaine Eschenbacher 27:42
So it sounds like you face that in your daily work all the time?
Benjawen Jearanaivitthayakul 27:47
You do? Yeah. And I just thought, you know, before I just thought, like, do we need to help them, you
know, get better. And you know, like, you know, get them out of the hospital have them a quality life.
But do we really, you know, ask them what they really want to do. Some patient you just saw them, I
can see them like they feel miserable. And why are they doing this? Is it for themselves? For their
family, or for what?
Elaine Eschenbacher 28:24
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Which experiences that you've had at Augsburg so far stand out to you as meaningful opportunities to
learn and reflect and then integrate lessons across your coursework and community engaged learning.
Benjawen Jearanaivitthayakul 28:40
So, I think, you know, like the coursework at Augsburg really made me think about volunteer at the
community. So, I know I want to go volunteer at Health Commons of inner city, but it's quite far of a
drive. But I do volunteer at the community down here when they have a free times. So I volunteer at the
food bank here as well. And I also volunteer at Good Samaritan Clinic to be a nurse there for quite
some time during, you know, when they have a school time off. So I just thought, you know, like a
helping community is a good way to serve our community.
Elaine Eschenbacher 29:39
I know you're only partway through your time at Augsburg, but so far, is there anything that you wish
you learned during your time here but haven't yet?
Benjawen Jearanaivitthayakul 29:54
I missed the opportunity to go to many field trip in my first year. So in my first year, like I signed up for
Amish community, because I want to learn about Amish. Because I think their lives so interesting. And I
did not know much about Amish community, even though I live close to Amish community here. But I
thought a sign up to spend time at Amish community would be a really good experience, but then the
trip was canceled. So I wish to learn about that. And I also, you know, like I signed up for civil rights trip
as well to learn about Dakota people. But it was canceled two years in a row. And I just, I feel like, I
missed those, you know, like, experience, and I'm not sure if this year they're gonna do it again or not.
But you know, this year, I have many classes that I have to take, and I may not be able to take time off
for that. Sometimes it's just time and the thing in our life, just not matching. So it was a bummer.
Elaine Eschenbacher 31:39
How has the pandemic changed your view of the profession of nursing?
Benjawen Jearanaivitthayakul 31:53
Wow, pandemics really make our job more challenging. Yeah, so if you think about it, like, at the first
year, when COVID just started, everybody scared to take care of the COVID patient, they're scared of
contracting COVID, and then bring the COVID back to their home. And, yeah, it's quite a, you know,
challenging for all of us. And also at work, we have to do a lot of precaution. I become like, I have to
clean nursing station on the computer every time before I make the badge in and before I use the
computer, because you never know who use that computer? And do they wash their hands? Yeah, I'd
become like, you know, have to clean up everything. And before I entered to the COVID patients, it's
just, you know, we have to wear ISO gown, we have to wear, you know, N95, and sometimes just feel
like it's just exhausting. Sometimes I just feel like I didn't want to be a nurse anymore, because it's just
so exhausting. And it just changed the way that you know, we learned about COVID. So, like I said, the
trip was cancel, so we didn't get the experience that we need to be doing. So we have to do more, you
know, online classes. And it's just some time, it's just your online class. It is nice. However, sometimes
it's nice to just immerse yourself to that kind of experience. Because just see it, smell it, experience it,
listen to it, and just be there. So then you understand a situation is not just from reading. I mean, I took,
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like, learning about health disparity in Africa. And that class should be like a field trip in Africa, but I took
over online because, you know, in that year was COVID. So it does feel like it's a lot of reading the
book was good. But then it just feel like, Oh, I missed the experience to really go there. And, you know,
like really see how the people look like. Because, of course I was on the TV and it was on the
documentary, but it's not the same as being there yourself. I would want to say that how COVID change
everything. So but we have to adapt to it because obviously in that time we did not have much choices
rather than go online.
Elaine Eschenbacher 35:16
Do you feel like you have been able to have a voice in decision making in the constantly changing
landscape of healthcare? And if so, how? And if no, why not?
Benjawen Jearanaivitthayakul 35:28
Got it. So, sometimes I think I do, because sometimes I should bring up you know, like, some issue
with, you know, with the patient, especially like patient Co-op care. So, we need to be addressed, and
we need to have the doctor on board. So, I addressed that and, you know, like some doctor, sometime,
Doctor, you know, they agree. But sometime, we have some kind of conflict, about how some patient,
they have mental health as well, when they are on dialysis. And when they, you know, when they talk to
me, or when they discuss the goal of care with me, and they talk one thing, right, and then when we
bring it up, and we address, you know, with the healthcare provider, and then the healthcare provider
would say to me that, you know, because the patient has some kind of mental health, she is not
capable to make her own decision. So, it is quite challenging. So then who will be the person who make
decision for her. And it have to go by that person rather than her herself. So I just thought, you know,
like, sometimes it's more complicated than what I can do.
Elaine Eschenbacher 37:18
That was the last question, but I would just like to ask if there's anything else you'd like to share on any
of these topics?
Benjawen Jearanaivitthayakul 37:28
I can think of it right now. I think I have talking a lot.
Elaine Eschenbacher 37:38
Oh, it's great. It's great. Thank you. Well, I want to thank you so much for your time and your insight on
this. I know that you're busy and you've got a lot going on. And we really appreciate you contributing
and participating in this project.
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